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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3255
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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 Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 7:58 am Post subject: Grace .....means, God's Power to Obey |
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"God's unmerited favor towards man, as the Divine influence operating in man, by God's Spirit, to the renewing of the heart and restraining man from committing sin",
(Noah Webster's Dictionary 1828, and the Encycopedic Dictionary 1967)
Romans 1:5 " By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
1:6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ"
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Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 5:42 pm Post subject: Re: Grace .....means, God's Power to Obey |
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| Silver Surfer wrote: | "God's unmerited favor towards man, as the Divine influence operating in man, by God's Spirit, to the renewing of the heart and restraining man from committing sin",
(Noah Webster's Dictionary 1828, and the Encycopedic Dictionary 1967)
Romans 1:5 " By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
1:6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ"
*****************************************
Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
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Therefore,
Grace which is unmerited pardon
comes from
Love which is unconditional,
which Love gives us the Power of Love to give unmerited pardon or forgiveness to ourselves and to our brothers JUST AS God gives us unmerited forgiveness or pardon BY HIS Unconditional Love.
Therefore, as with faith,
Grace works by Love. gal 5:6.
Therefore it is Love that gives us the power of God to obey the law of Love AND.....any other laws!
So SS, out of your mouth you've said it:
The first thing people need IN ORDER TO OBEY GOD is the Power by which to obey God: ....God's Power to Obey.
And by 2 other proofs, what power do we need to obey God?
2 Timothy 1:
7For God hath not given us the spirit of fear;
but of power, and of Love, and of a sound mind.
2 Corinthians 12:
9And he said unto me,
My grace [THE GRACE OF MY LOVE] is sufficient for thee:
for my strength is made perfect in weakness.
Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
10Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake:
for when I am weak, then am I strong.
in the power of God's Love that gives us the power by which to be in an obedient attitude of mind to God at all times even when, especially when disobedient,
atoz |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3255
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2007 7:05 pm Post subject: Re: Grace .....means, God's Power to Obey |
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| atoz wrote: | | Silver Surfer wrote: | "God's unmerited favor towards man, as the Divine influence operating in man, by God's Spirit, to the renewing of the heart and restraining man from committing sin",
(Noah Webster's Dictionary 1828, and the Encycopedic Dictionary 1967)
Romans 1:5 " By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
1:6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ"
*****************************************
Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
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Therefore,
Grace which is unmerited pardon
comes from
Love which is unconditional,
which Love gives us the Power of Love to give unmerited pardon or forgiveness to ourselves and to our brothers JUST AS God gives us unmerited forgiveness or pardon BY HIS Unconditional Love.
Therefore, as with faith,
Grace works by Love. gal 5:6.
Therefore it is Love that gives us the power of God to obey the law of Love AND.....any other laws!
So SS, out of your mouth you've said it:
The first thing people need IN ORDER TO OBEY GOD is the Power by which to obey God: ....God's Power to Obey.
And by 2 other proofs, what power do we need to obey God?
2 Timothy 1:
7For God hath not given us the spirit of fear;
but of power, and of Love, and of a sound mind.
2 Corinthians 12:
9And he said unto me,
My grace [THE GRACE OF MY LOVE] is sufficient for thee:
for my strength is made perfect in weakness.
Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
10Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake:
for when I am weak, then am I strong.
in the power of God's Love that gives us the power by which to be in an obedient attitude of mind to God at all times even when, especially when disobedient,
atoz |
AND THAT is what puts us in opposition to satan !
To love satan, is to hate God.
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2007 4:27 pm Post subject: Re: Grace .....means, God's Power to Obey |
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| Silver Surfer wrote: |
[AND THAT is what puts us in opposition to satan !
To love satan, is to hate God. |
Just saw this!
hmmmmm
To love satan can NOT be to hate God
simply because
Satan means opposer, adversary, enemy, 1 Peter 5:8-9
and
God is an adversary and enemy, Exod 23:22,
and
God commands us to love Satan, matth 5:43-48
and
God condemns Satan for hating Satan's own enemies just as God condemns us for hating any enemy.1 John 4:20.
So to love Satan as God commands
is to obey God and is to worship God, Romans 6:16,
and
is to love God as our friend and as our enemy, which is to love God under all conditions and unconditionally.
So to hate satan as our enemy
is to hate God as our enemy
and
is to disobey God and to obey Satan who deceives us into hating him so he can get us to disobey God.
Rev 12:9.
In Love of God and Satan as commanded by God,
Mt 5:43-48,
atoz |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3255
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2007 5:45 pm Post subject: Re: Grace .....means, God's Power to Obey |
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I wonder when you will start believing what God said ?
No One can love both God andf satan at the same time.
God said it is impossible !
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:18 pm Post subject: Re: Grace .....means, God's Power to Obey |
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| Silver Surfer wrote: | I wonder when you will start believing what God said ?
No One can love both God andf satan at the same time.
God said it is impossible ! |
Just saw this!
No, God did not mean what you understood by & from what He said in Matthew 6:24!
What God meant by what He said was:
No Ungodly man,
no satanic man can serve two masters like a Godly man can as I have just told you in the previous chapter, a few verses ago: I God love both the good man and the evil man, the just and the unjust, the friend and the enemy!
And so I want to do do the same as I and i made you to do so, and I know you can do so and be perfct as i am perfect.
Haven't you read that?
Like this:
We all know that men have hated, like hated JC in John 15:25:
So this is what God means here too in Ephesians 5: 28-29:
So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies , that is, as themselves.
He that loveth his wife loveth himself. hmmmmm
For no man OF GOD ever yet hated his own flesh AS MEN OF SATAN OR MEN OF HATE HATE THEMSELVES;
but EVERY MAN OF GOD OR EVERY MAN OF LOVE nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
I hope that God is opening your heart to see how His Love works so well.
Now carry on smartly and wisely..in Love!smile
I do believe that with Love who God is, all things are possible!
U?
U beleive that too, right?smi;e
Haven;t you read that before, SS?
I know you have!
So c'mon.
in Love and R,
atoz |
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lone-traveler
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 6365
Location: USA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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So when we Hate Satan..who is Hate, then we become like him in his image and likeness.
But if we Love Satan...who is Hate, then Love which is stronger than Hate will bind it.
And then will we be in the image and likeness of God who is Love.
like giving a cup of cold water to a thirsty enemy...it's like dumping hot coals on his head and burning him up into ashes...
Hate has NO POWER unless we feed it more hate, so we have to starve it with Love.
_________________
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 7:13 pm Post subject: |
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| lone-traveler wrote: | So when we Hate Satan..who is Hate, then we become like him in his image and likeness.
But if we Love Satan...who is Hate, then Love which is stronger than Hate will bind it.
And then will we be in the image and likeness of God who is Love.
like giving a cup of cold water to a thirsty enemy...it's like dumping hot coals on his head and burning him up into ashes...
Hate has NO POWER unless we feed it more hate, so we have to starve it with Love.
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LT,
That deserves to be said twice, it is soooooooooo nice!
Reminds me of this:
The Wolves Within
A grandson told of his anger at a schoolmate who had done him an injustice.
Grandfather said:
"Let me tell you a story.
I, too, have felt a great Hate for those that have taken so much, with no sorrow for what they do.
But, Hate wears you down and does not hurt your enemy.
It is like taking poison and wishing your enemy would die.
I have struggled with these feelings many times.
It is as if there are two wolves inside me:
one is good and does no harm.
He lives in harmony with all around him and does not take offense when no offense was intended. He will only fight when it is right to do so, and in the right way.
But the other wolf is full of anger.
The littlest thing will set him into a fit of temper.
He fights with everyone, all the time, for no reason.
He cannot think because his anger and Hate are so great.
It is hard to live with these two wolves inside me, for both of then try to dominate my spirit."
The boy looked intently into his grandfather's eyes and asked,
"Which one wins, Grandfather?"
The grandfather solemnly replied,
"The one I feed."
In Love of feeding Love to the Sin of Hate,
atoz |
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ShardikSon
Bear Cub
Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Posts: 606
Location: Aux Arcs
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| Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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I know I am newbie, but I think this deserves a bump.
And to cover it from scripture,
| Quote: | Matthew 5, 43 - 48, KJV:
Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
44But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
45That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
46For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
47And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
48Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. |
So yes, if Satan is the enemy, we are commanded to love him as any other enemy.
There can a vast difference between "to love" and "to serve".
_________________
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"Logic is a defined process for going wrong with confidence and certainty" - CF Kettering
“In prayer it is better to have a heart without words than words without a heart. “- Mohandas Gandhi
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I delight greatly in the LORD;
my soul rejoices in my God...
- Isaiah 61:10 (NIV) |
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joman
Tiger
Joined: 07 Jun 2004
Posts: 848
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| Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 11:12 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Matthew 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
44But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you |
II Chronicles 19:2 "...Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the Lord?"
If a person believes in the satanic philosophy of unconditional love they can't answer this question correctly.
The answer is...No! That isn't what child of God should do.
Is there a contradiction here? The answer is...No!
Note that we are first commanded to love God with all our heart, and mind and strength and then to love our neighbors as we love ourselves
In the verses above it tells us to love our/your enemies.
However, if we love God first then we can't love them that hate him because they are the enemies of our brethren (even children).
Remember how Jesus turned the other cheek and didn't defend himself agaisnt the might of Rome as he could've.
Yet, and nevertheless, Jesus cast his Father's enemies out of the temple with a whip!
The difference is that the one is in defense of one's own life which Jesus said leads to death while the other is Jesus' defense of others namely his Father.
If I love the brethren then I will destroy the enemy of their souls when I can oppose him lest my brethren suffer eternal condemnation.
Joman. |
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