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dez33333
Not So Newbie
Joined: 26 Jul 2007
Posts: 8
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 Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 10:52 pm Post subject: if every single one of us were to pray for satan, |
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| could God change him the way he changes our friends and family members when we pray for THEM? |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 8:18 am Post subject: Re: if every single one of us were to pray for satan, |
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| dez33333 wrote: | | could God change him the way he changes our friends and family members when we pray for THEM? |
Yes!!!!!!!!
In fact, Dez, that IS God's Plan!
That is why God says we are first to LOVE Satan, [please read Matthew 5:43-48; 1 Peter 5:8-9,]
so we can then pray in Love for him,
or,
even if we do NOT pray for Him,
we will still love him as per God, Love of itself being the spirit of prayer!
Then as Members of God's Family,
we will with Love for Satan judge him and his bad angels, and so forgive them and teach them to love themselves and forgive themselves and love US human beings whom Satan and his demons hate and have always hated!
nb: Good angels don't need to be judged!
So the angels we will judge with Love are the bad angels!
1 Corinthians 6
1 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?
2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels?
how much more things that pertain to this life?
The King of Nineveh and the Ninevites are a type of Satan and his demons/ bad angels: Jonah hated the Ninevites and so did NOT want to go save them, whereas God loved the Ninevites and wanted to save them: so God forced Jonah to go to Nineveh anyway, and so Jonah was very angry in Hate of the bad guys.
Jonah 3
1And the word of the LORD came unto Jonah the second time,
saying,
2Arise, go unto Nineveh, that great city, and preach unto it the preaching that I bid thee.
3So Jonah arose,
and went unto Nineveh, according to the word of the LORD.
Now Nineveh was an exceeding great city of three days' journey.
4And Jonah began to enter into the city a day's journey, and he cried, and said,
Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown.
5So the people of Nineveh believed God,
and proclaimed a fast,
and put on sackcloth, from the greatest of them even to the least of them.
6For word came unto the king of Nineveh,
and he arose from his throne,
and he laid his robe from him,
and covered him with sackcloth,
and sat in ashes.
7And he caused it to be proclaimed and published through Nineveh by the decree of the king and his nobles, saying,
Let neither man nor beast, herd nor flock, taste any thing: let them not feed, nor drink water:
8But let man and beast be covered with sackcloth,
and cry mightily unto God:
yea, let them turn every one from his evil way,
and from the violence that is in their hands.
9Who can tell if God will turn and repent,
and turn away from his fierce anger, that we perish not?
10And God saw their works,
that they turned from their evil way;
and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them;
and he did it not.
Here is Jonah being upset in Hate of the Ninevites that the Ninevites had repented and so wd be saved: in his Hate for them, Jonah wd have been pleased and rejoicing that they had NOT repented so God wd destroy them:
Proverbs 24:
17 Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth:
18 Lest the LORD see it, and it displease him, and he turn away his wrath from him.
Because God loves sinners and satan, God takes NO pleasure at the death of the wicked:
Ezekiel 18:23
23Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?
32For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye.
Jonah 4
1But it displeased Jonah exceedingly,
and he was very angry.
2And he prayed unto the LORD, and said,
I pray thee, O LORD, was not this my saying, when I was yet in my country?
Therefore I fled before unto Tarshish:
for I knew that thou art a gracious God,
and merciful, slow to anger,
and of great kindness,
and repentest thee of the evil.
3Therefore now, O LORD, take, I beseech thee, my life from me; for it is better for me to die than to live.
4Then said the LORD,
Doest thou well to be angry?
Your idea of praying for satan is a Godly thought,
so you are on the right track of Love as God loves, and from which Love for yourself as God loves u, God wants you to start in finding Him:
Matthew 22:
35Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying,
36Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37Jesus said unto him,
Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38This is the first and great commandment.
39And the second is like unto it,
Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40On these two commandments hang
all the law and the prophets.
1 John 4:19 We love him, because he first loved us.
John 15:9
9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
with all Godly Love and Respect,
atoz
Last edited by atoz on Sun Jul 29, 2007 8:32 am; edited 2 times in total |
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MoJo
Moderator
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 3401
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 8:22 am Post subject: |
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1Jo 5:16 If any man see his brother sin a sin **[which is] not unto death**, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.
_________________
matt 6: 34 "Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof." |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 8:34 am Post subject: |
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| MoJo wrote: | 1Jo 5:16 If any man see his brother sin a sin **[which is] not unto death**, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.
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Mojo!
I love that verse and those brackets!smile
with Love and R,
atoz
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graphicsguy
Alley Cat
Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 198
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| Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:52 am Post subject: Re: if every single one of us were to pray for satan, |
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| dez33333 wrote: | | could God change him the way he changes our friends and family members when we pray for THEM? |
What difference would it make if we did? How would life on earth change? |
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dez33333
Not So Newbie
Joined: 26 Jul 2007
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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| seriously??? you mean OTHER than no more crime or sin??? satan makes us do all that stuff. without him to tempt us, we wouldn't do it. |
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graphicsguy
Alley Cat
Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 198
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 6:29 am Post subject: |
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So, man isn't capable of evil without Satan tempting him? Sounds like wishful thinking to me. Do you really think, "The devil made me do it?" is a legimate argument in court cases then?
What about people who are mentally ill and sin on a regular basis, but then medication makes them better? Does the medication nullify Satan's power? Does it drive the demons out of them? |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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| dez33333 wrote: | | seriously??? you mean OTHER than no more crime or sin??? satan makes us do all that stuff. without him to tempt us, we wouldn't do it. |
Dez,
Satan can NOT make us sin without our prior permission.
God loves you as good and as bad. Matthew 5:43-48.
So it is only if you have been taught to hate yourself as bad, and so do hate yourself as bad, that Satan has already got you to sin by hating you who God loves as himself.
John 15:9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
So then Satan will come along and show you somebody else who is bad, and before you know it, you are also hating that person as bad as yourself.
Then he'll make being goody goody a bad,
and before you know it, bam! you are also now hating yourself as goody-goody!
Then since you now hate you as GOOD and as BAD, well bad people do such and such: so in that Hateful attitude, you do go and DO something that hurts you and others.
Then you hate you as a hurter and as a sinner, and here we go again!
see?
But if you repent of the sin of hating yourself, acts 2:38, and commit to loving you as good and as bad, then you have the GOOD attitude of Love that will make you good even when bad, and make you doubly good when good.
Then with that Love for you as good and as bad, satan can NOT get you to sin the first sin: of hating you, that leads to all the other things that you don't wanna do!
see James 1: 12Blessed is the man that [WITH LOVE]endureth temptation:
for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.
13Let no man [WHO IS IN HATE] say when he is tempted, I am tempted [IN HATE] of[/BY] God:
for God cannot be tempted with [THE] evil [OF HATRED], neither tempteth he any man [WITH HATE BUT HE TESTS OR TEMPTS EVERY MAN WITH LVOE: GENESIS 22:1]:
14But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust [THAT IS CAUSED BY HATRED FOR WHAT HE DOES NOT WANT], and enticed.
15Then when lust [DUE TO HATRED] hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin:
and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth [DOUBLE] death: [THE DEATH OF LOVE AND NOW THE DEATH OF LIFE].
Plus, satan hates Love and can't stand nor bear to be around Love: so when you are filled with Love, he will flee from you: James 4: 7Submit yourselves [IN LOVE]therefore to God. [WITH LOVE] Resist the devil, and he [WHO IS IN HATE]will flee from you [WHO ARE IN LOVE].
8Draw nigh [IN LOVE] to God, and he will draw nigh [IN LOVE] to you. Cleanse your hands [YOUR HEARTS OF THE SIN OF HATRED], ye sinners.
1 Peter 5:
6Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand[/LOVE] of God, that he may exalt you in due time:
7Casting all your care upon him; for he careth for you.
8Be sober [IN LOVE], be vigilant [IN LOVE];
because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about [IN HATE], seeking whom [IS IN HATE THAT]he may devour:
9Whom resist stedfast in the faith [THAT WORKS BY LOVE: GALATIANS 5:6], knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world
1 Peter 4
8And above all things have fervent [LOVE] among yourselves:
for [LOVE] shall cover the multitude of sins.
Proverbs 10: 12 Hatred stirreth up strifes:
but love covereth[CLEANSES] all sins.
Then with you in that Love, he can't handle you and now you can handle him like a cinch with ONE word: Love,
as in 'Love ya! Now Git in Love!'
So it is Love that will beat satan, our 3rd worse enemy, and will beat our #1 worse enemy: ourselves.
Hate of self is our first crime!
So Love of self as God loves you eliminates crime by eliminating the criminal attitude of hatred for self and for others as self.
Hope that helps.
With the Medicine of Love that cures the Illness of Hatred,
with the Force-field Shield of Love that satan's arrows and man's arrows can't pierce,
atoz |
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holly102869
Fierce Poodle
Joined: 26 Jul 2007
Posts: 278
Location: Central, Florida USA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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Yes we should all pray for Satan. Never with him.
Remember though he is the root of all evil.With him you are playing with something that can twist you.
I don't think it would change his mind at all.
You have to want to change.
Free Will and all.
Just like someone that has a drug addiction. You can try and try to help them but, to no change. The day the person faces the addiction and wants to change is the day the doors will open and help will arrive. This is something that only the addicted person can do.
The same with Satan. God would help him but unfortunatley for us Satans wrath will not be swayed.
Lord have Mercy on us
Holly |
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RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 7005
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Remember though he is the root of all evil.With |
Don't scriptures tell us that the love of money is the root of all evil?
_________________
JP's Mind - my blog
Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
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holly102869
Fierce Poodle
Joined: 26 Jul 2007
Posts: 278
Location: Central, Florida USA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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Who is behind the love of money?
God? Or
Satan?
God made man equal but Satan tells us we are different with the use of money.
Who talked Eve into eating the fruit?
Shall we go on? |
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graphicsguy
Alley Cat
Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 198
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| holly102869 wrote: | | ]The same with Satan. God would help him but unfortunatley for us Satans wrath will not be swayed. |
But God made Satan for the express purpose of being evil incarnate...I don't think he really wants him to change...
| holly102869 wrote: | Who is behind the love of money?
God? Or
Satan? |
Or just man's basic survival instinct?
| Quote: | | God made man equal but Satan tells us we are different with the use of money. |
What?
| Quote: | | Who talked Eve into eating the fruit? |
Apparently a talking snake. However, Eve made a choice.
Why not? I'm fascinated at the idea of Satan turning good and the earth becoming a utopian society. |
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holly102869
Fierce Poodle
Joined: 26 Jul 2007
Posts: 278
Location: Central, Florida USA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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graphicsguy
By the way it is the poor that will inherite the earth. In other words the rich have there money to protect them but, the poor have God because they seek him. Don't think that the rich don't think they are better than the poor. If they didn't they would share the wealth. When you die you can't take money with you.
Who is the snake? When he talked to Eve didn't he walk on legs? Who did he worship?
Heaven or the garden of eden is not a utopia.
It is a way of life without evil, better than any utopia.
I don't believe that that is why God created Satan. Wasn't he an angel that fell from grace?
God doesn't create anything bad our free will lets us choose. Satan choose to rebell the word of God.
Satan will have his time ruling the Earth and I believe that time has come.
My survival instinct is not money. Money can not save your soul!
Read the book of Job This is the way Satan works. He test you in every way and he is real. |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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| RevJP wrote: | | Quote: | | Remember though he is the root of all evil.With |
Don't scriptures tell us that the love of money is the root of all evil? |
Good point, Rev.
And since God loves money and made it,
and loves both the rich and the poor, riches and poverty,
then what the sciptures also tell us is that:
the Love of anything OUT OF HATE for its opposite
is
THE root or formula or principle of ALL evil or sin.
Example: Lust is simply desire for what I love OUT OF HATE for what I don't desire.
Here is Jesus saying it in other words:
Matthew 5:
43Ye have heard that it hath been said,
Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and [OR OUT OF] hate [FOR] thine enemy.
44But I say unto you,
Love your [FRIENDS OUT OF LOVE FOR YOUR] enemies,
bless [IN LOVE] them that [BLESS YOU OUT OF LOVE FOR THEM] curse you,
do good [IN LOVE] to them [WHO LOVE YOU OUT OF LOVE FOR THEM] that hate you,
and pray [IN LOVE FOR THEM THAT KINDLY USE YOU OUT OF LOVE] for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven:
for he maketh his sun to rise [IN LOVE] on the evil and [IN LOVE] on the good, and sendeth rain [IN LOVE] on the just and [IN LOVE] on the unjust.
46For if ye love them which love you [OUT OF HATE FOR THEM THAT HATE YOU], what reward have ye?
do not even the publicans the same?
47And if ye salute your brethren only [OUT OF HATE FOR THEM THAT DON'T SALUTE YOU], what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
48Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect [IN LOVE FOR THE PERFECT OUT OF LOVE FOR THE IMPERFECT].
So 1 Timothy 6:10
means:
For the love of money [OUT OF HATE FOR POVERTY] is the root of all evil:
which [MONEY] while some coveted after [OUT OF HATE FOR BEING POOR OR BEING LESS RICH],
they have erred from the faith [THAT LOVES BOTH BEING RICH AND BEING POOR],
and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.
2 Corin 8:
9For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ,
that, though he was rich,
yet for your sakes he became poor,
that ye through his poverty might be rich.
in the riches of God's Love for the money and no money,
and
in the poverty of God's Love
that makes poor in spirit
and
that makes us rich even when poor,
and that makes us doubly rich when rich,
atoz |
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graphicsguy
Alley Cat
Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 198
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:16 am Post subject: |
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| holly102869 wrote: | | By the way it is the poor that will inherite the earth. In other words the rich have there money to protect them but, the poor have God because they seek him. Don't think that the rich don't think they are better than the poor. If they didn't they would share the wealth. When you die you can't take money with you. |
That is a LOT of generalization in a couple of sentences.
| Quote: | | Who is the snake? When he talked to Eve didn't he walk on legs? Who did he worship? |
If the snake WAS Satan as Revelation "reveals", why did God punish the snake? Who says it had legs? Nobody knows that. Maybe it had feathers and flew. I don't know who he worshipped and neither do you. Are you saying the snake was a Satanist?
| Quote: | Heaven or the garden of eden is not a utopia.
It is a way of life without evil, better than any utopia. |
Life without evil...how to we grow and develop character without personal challenge? How can you have personal challenge without evil, death, hardship?
utopia:
2. an ideal place or state.
3. any visionary system of political or social perfection (sounds like the Christian version of heaven to me).
| Quote: | | I don't believe that that is why God created Satan. Wasn't he an angel that fell from grace? |
So, God is omniscient and didn't actually know that Satan would go bad?
Face it. He made Satan evil on purpose. Evil came out of God for he created all things. That is completely what Christian theology implies and there is no way around the concept. The world is exactly the way God wanted it to be.
| Quote: | | God doesn't create anything bad our free will lets us choose. Satan choose to rebell the word of God. |
So God didn't know the world would turn out the way it is? He's just barely staying one move ahead?
| Quote: | | Satan will have his time ruling the Earth and I believe that time has come. |
Do you believe the earth is a worse place than it was 2,000 years ago?
| Quote: | | My survival instinct is not money. Money can not save your soul! |
That's good. It doesn't save your soul, but it does keep you off the streets.
| Quote: | | Read the book of Job This is the way Satan works. He test you in every way and he is real. |
Read it. All it says about Satan is that he has to work within the limits God sets for him. God brought up the subject of Job, God made the bet, God let it happen. |
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