 |
Bible-Discussion.com
Private Bible Studies and Christian Fellowship Available - Ask Nobby
|
|
|
| Author |
Message |
Eddy
Little Guppy
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Posts: 39
|
 Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 9:05 pm Post subject: Feedback |
 |
|
I wonder if u guys had any opinions on this:
I spoke to an ex-priest over the weekend about my whole Christian / Gay extravaganza, and we had a LONG LONG chat about what the Bible says about it.
I told him about all the things i had read on this board and he said that Paul (theres a bit about gays in Paul right?) was VERY judgementalm and that many people believe he had his own adgenda other than spreading Christs word.
Also, Jesus backed up what he believed in the Old Testament and never mentioned Lectivus, or anything about homosexuality himself.
Also (bear in mind this conversation is from memory, im not too good at quoting and may have got the wrong end of the stick completly) that the early Church worked towards power as opposed to spreading Jesus' message, and thats why there are so many rules.They often, are not part of Chists message, but are used to control people. His bottom line was, why, as a follower of Christ, would you live your life according to what Paul says is right or wrong?
would love to know your thoughts on this... |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
|
|
RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 6828
Location: USA
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 12:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
I suppose the whole thing depends upon whether you accept the bible as the Holy Inspired Word of God, or not.
It is apparent that your ex-priest probably does not. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
johnp.
Tadpole
Joined: 13 May 2007
Posts: 27
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 4:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | Also, Jesus backed up what he believed in the Old Testament and never mentioned Lectivus, or anything about homosexuality himself. |
Jesus is the Word of God and as such had the OT written Eddy. 
john. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
rjustice7
Growing Guppy
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 41
Location: Johnson City, TX
|
| Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:47 am Post subject: Here's a thought... |
|
|
| I just can’t believe that God would leave us a faulty word, tainted by man’s negative character traits and bad examples. If the early church wasn’t a good example, then why would God allow it to be part of His word? Paul also was an upstanding man of God. I concur with revjp when he says that the Bible was the inspired word of God. Let’s look at II Timothy 3:16- All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. Johnp also has a good point. Jesus is the word of God. This can be found in John 1. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
FFT
Emperor of the Galaxy
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 5859
Location: Memphis
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 5:43 pm Post subject: Re: Here's a thought... |
|
|
| rjustice7 wrote: | | If the early church wasn’t a good example, then why would God allow it to be part of His word? |
Insert argument: religious pluralism. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
|
| Posted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 6:40 pm Post subject: Re: Feedback |
|
|
| Eddy wrote: | I wonder if u guys had any opinions on this:
I spoke to an ex-priest over the weekend about my whole Christian / Gay extravaganza, and we had a LONG LONG chat about what the Bible says about it.
I told him about all the things i had read on this board and he said that Paul (theres a bit about gays in Paul right?) was VERY judgementalm and that many people believe he had his own adgenda other than spreading Christs word.
Also, Jesus backed up what he believed in the Old Testament and never mentioned Lectivus, or anything about homosexuality himself.
Also (bear in mind this conversation is from memory, im not too good at quoting and may have got the wrong end of the stick completly) that the early Church worked towards power as opposed to spreading Jesus' message, and thats why there are so many rules.They often, are not part of Chists message, but are used to control people. His bottom line was, why, as a follower of Christ, would you live your life according to what Paul says is right or wrong?
would love to know your thoughts on this... |
Hi Eddy,
Don't know if you are still around. If u are, here is some encouragement for you:
[ THE EX=PRIEST was right in his conclusions but wrong as to how he got there: Paul is saying the same thing as JC: Unconditional Love for all means that therefore hatred of any person, place or thing is THE sin that makes any thought or word or deed BAD. JC did talk about celibacy: see matthew 19.]
Because God's Love is unconditional, Matthew 5:43-48,
when we apply Love to any subject, in this case homosexuality, or gays for short, we first have to ask the following question to see if we are obeying God's 1st law of Love:
Do I love gays and straights as God loves them unconditionally?
Do I love myself as gay and as straight so that I can love gays as myself and love straights as myself?
Why this is so important is because since God loves both straights and gays, my first sin, THE 1st sin is to believe the idea or believe in the idea that it is ok to hate gays or straights.
In fact, that Hate for either gays or straights is the sin that makes everything else a sin!
Examples:
Hate for myself as angry makes me angry in Hate, which is how we are angry and sin. See matthew 5:21-22 and Eph 5:26.
When I love myself as angry, then I am nagry in Love, and that is how I can be angry and sin not.
So anger and its opposite are neutral emotions, neither being a sin of itself, Romans 14:,
and which Love makes right when we love em both,
and which Hate makes wrong when we hate either emotion.
So too with gays and straights:
Both are not sins in themselves, they are each neutral beings and acts, and Love for both makes each right, and Hate for either makes both sinful and wrong.
Now with this attitude in mind of Love for both pairs of opposites as in Matthew 5:43-48, this is how Leviticus 18 and Romans 1 shd be read as they were written: in Love for each word and its opposite or enemy: I'll jst do a few verses to show you all of what God meant and what lies hidden in Love in the words:
First notice how LOVE is separate command from the other commandments and statutes and judgments and ordinances and precepts.
Joshua 22:5
But take diligent heed to do the commandment and the law, which Moses the servant of the LORD charged you, to love the LORD your God,
and to walk in all his ways,
and to keep his commandments,
and to cleave unto him,
and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul.
Leviticus 18
1And the LORD spake IN UNCONDITIONAL LOVE unto Moses, saying,
2Speak IN LOVE unto the children of Israel, and say unto them,
I am the LORD your God.
3After the TRADITIONS OF HATE IN THE doings of the land of Egypt, where in HATE ye dwelt, shall ye not do:
and after the HATE IN doings of the land of Canaan, whither IN LOVE I bring you, shall ye not do:
neither shall ye walk in HATE IN their ordinances.
4Ye shall do my judgments IN LOVE, and keep mine ordinances IN LOVE, to walk therein LOVE: I am the LORD your God.
5Ye shall therefore keep my statutes IN LOVE, and my judgments IN LOVE: which if a man do, he shall live *in* LOVE IN them: I am the LORD.
6OUT OF HATE FOR STRANGERS None of you shall approach to any that is *near of kin* to him, to uncover their nakedness:
AND VICE VERSA:
OUT OF HATE FOR FAMILY, NONE OF YOU SHD APPROACH ANY STRANGER;
BUT IN LOVE FOR BOTH FAMILY AND STRANGERS, YOU CAN APPROAH EITHER JUST AS I ALLOWED THE BROS AND SISTERS WHO WERE ADAM'S AND EVE'S KIDS TO INTERMARRY IN LOVE OF NON-FAMILY:
AND IN LOVE OF BOTH, U CAN ALSO DECIDE TO APPROACH NEITHER: I am the LORD.
22Thou shalt IN HATE OF WOMANKIND not lie with mankind, as with womankind:
NOR IN HATE OF MANKIND LIE WITH WOMANKIND:
BUT IN LOVE OF BOTH, YOU CAN CHOOSE ONE OR THE OTHER.
THE HATE IN IT is abomination.
Are you seeing what God is really saying?
Here is paul when read as written: in Love:
Romans 1
22 Professing themselves to be wise with the foolish idea of Hate for fools, they became fools in Hate or twice fools: fools with the foolish idea that it is ok to hate fools,
[God wants us to love ourselves as wise and as fools so that with that wise idea of Love for both, I know when to be a fool in Love and when to be wise in Love, and when to be a fool with fools and wise with the wise and play the fool in Love, and etc.]
23And IN HATE OF THE GOD changed the glory of LOVE IN the uncorruptible God into an image OF HATRED made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts DUE TO THE HATE IN THEIR OWN HEARTS FOR WHAT THEY DID NOT WANT, to, BY THAT HATE AND DISRESPECT, dishonour their own bodies between themselves: [the dishonor does not come from having straight sex or gay sex or no sex but from the prior hatred in the hearts of either.]
25Who changed the truth of LOVE AND THEREFORE of God FOR LIARS AND TRUTHTELLERS, GAYS AND STRAIGHTS, ETC AND ETC, into THE lie OF HATE AND DISRESPECT FOR ONE OF THE OTHER, and SO IN HATE worshipped and served the creature more than THE LOVE IN WORSHIPPING the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26For this cause OF THE SIN OF HATRED God gave them up unto vile affections MADE VILE BY VILE HATRED:
for OUT OF HATE FOR MEN, even their women did change the natural use IN LOVE into that HATRED which is against nature: [it is the Hate that is unnatural, NOT the sex. see 1 Corin 11: MALE lions wear LONG hair: therefore men wearing short hair is against the natural use! Therefore, what Paul is talking about that is unnatural is the HATRED; what natural he is talking about is the LOVE.]
27And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman OUT OF HATE FOR WOMEN, burned in their lust one toward another;
IN HATE OF WOMEN men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
AND OUT OF HATE FOR NO SEX, STRAIGHTS LUSTED FOR AND HAD SEX AND TOO MUCH SEX;
AND OUT OF HATE FOR SEX, OTHERS HAD no SEX.
Any Hatres involved makes all otherwise normal acts sinful by that very hatred.
28And even as they did *not like* BUT HATED to retain LOVE AND THERFORE God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind OF HATE, to do IN HATE those things which are not convenient;
29Being filled with all OF THE unrighteousness OF HATE, fornication=SEX IN HATE OF NO SEX,
wickedness IN HATE OF THE good,
covetousness IN HATE OF WHAT THEY DID NOT WANT,
*maliciousness=HATRED*;
full of HATE IN envy,
murder=KILLING IN HATE,
debate IN HATE,
deceit IN HATE,
malignity IN HATE;
whisperers IN HATE,
30Backbiters IN HATE,
**haters of God,**
despiteful IN HATE,
proud IN HATE OF BEING HUMBLE,
boasters IN HATE OF UNDERACHIEVERS,
inventors of evil things IN HATE OF GOOD THINGS, disobedient to parents IN HATE OF PARENTS,
31Without THE understanding OF LOVE,
covenant-OF-LOVE-breakers,
THEREFORE without THE natural affection THAT COMES FROM UNCONDITIONAL LOVE,
implacable IN HATE,
unmerciful IN HATE:
32Who 'knowing' IN HATE the judgment of God, that they which HATE AND commit such things IN HATE are worthy of death, not only do the same IN HATE, but have pleasure in them that do them IN HATE.
Please ask questions.
in Love and Respect of myself as gay and as str8s so I can love you as gay and love all gays and all str8s as myself and as God loves them and you as Himself,
atoz |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Diane
Cobra
Joined: 17 Sep 2004
Posts: 470
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 9:13 am Post subject: Re: Feedback |
|
|
Hi Eddy,
Jesus came to fulfill the law....fulfilled in His most holy royal law of love. So, therefore, homosexuality as well as anything that may cause us to miss the mark, is something for Jesus. For all have sinned and missed the mark. Something for Jesus to cover and sanctify and purge from us in order to fulfill his royal law of love. And in the end.....we become love as He is love. His job, not mine.....and He will do it. For none shall be snatched out of His hand.
IMO, Paul himself was in the process of being sanctified as he wrote his letters. I see a progression toward love in his letters and away from actual discussion of sin. But then maybe that's been my own experience. Perception is everthing. It's only a guess, but as Paul faced the executioner, his only thought was for Christ and His redeeming love....his heart filled with gratitude to the Savior for His power to complete what Christ had begun in him.
Praise God!
Love,
Diane |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MoJo
Moderator
Joined: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 3188
Location: Canada
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 9:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hello Diane. Nice to hear from you. Hope all is well.
God bless.
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Diane
Cobra
Joined: 17 Sep 2004
Posts: 470
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 9:37 am Post subject: |
|
|
| MoJo wrote: | Hello Diane. Nice to hear from you. Hope all is well.
God bless.
|
Hi Mojo!! 
Good to hear from you, too. All is well, sis. And you?
For the most part, I've been off the boards for about 4.5 years now. I still read them but have very little to say. Felt moved today. Go figure.
Much love to you,
Di |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
|
| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 5:41 pm Post subject: Re: Feedback |
|
|
| Diane wrote: | Hi Eddy,
Jesus came to fulfill the law....fulfilled in His most holy royal law of love. So, therefore, homosexuality as well as anything that may cause us to miss the mark, is something for Jesus. For all have sinned and missed the mark. Something for Jesus to cover and sanctify and purge from us in order to fulfill his royal law of love. And in the end.....we become love as He is love. ....
IMO, Paul himself was in the process of being sanctified as he wrote his letters. I see a progression toward love in his letters and away from actual discussion of sin.
...
It's only a guess, but as Paul faced the executioner, his only thought was for Christ and His redeeming love....his heart filled with gratitude to the Savior for His power to complete what Christ had begun in him.
Praise God!
Love,
Diane |
Hi Diane,
Glad you felt moved to write.
Excellent! Loved your cmt.
Please write more!smile
in Love,
atoz |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Diane
Cobra
Joined: 17 Sep 2004
Posts: 470
|
| Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:54 pm Post subject: Re: Feedback |
|
|
| Atoz wrote: | Hi Diane,
Glad you felt moved to write.
Excellent! Loved your cmt.
Please write more!smile
in Love,
atoz |
Hello atoz
Thank you for your kind words. It is a joy to speak of our Great God and Savior and His redeeming love.
In His Love,
Diane |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
FAQ 
Search 
Make a Donation 
Usergroups 
Contact
Register
Submit Articles 
Log in to check your private messages 
