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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3123
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 Posted: Mon May 07, 2007 3:14 pm Post subject: Jihad - to Struggle... |
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SOUND familiar?
Based on some of the views being propogated from our Middle-Eastern brothers HERE... I really don't see the difference.
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Exodus 20:11 "For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them..."
‘The German Führer, as I have consistently maintained, is an evolutionist; he has consciously sought to make the practice of Germany conform to the theory of evolution.’ Sir Arthur Keith |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8326
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2007 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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I think you're going to have to draw the parallels a little more explicitly than that...
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3123
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2007 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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| P1234567890 wrote: | | I think you're going to have to draw the parallels a little more explicitly than that... |
Mein Kamf - My struggle...
Jihad - to struggle...
Both hate/d Jews with their very essence...
Result - 1945 / 6 Million Dead
2007 - (With a nuclear Iran) possibly 7 million
_________________
Exodus 20:11 "For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them..."
‘The German Führer, as I have consistently maintained, is an evolutionist; he has consciously sought to make the practice of Germany conform to the theory of evolution.’ Sir Arthur Keith |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8326
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Mon May 07, 2007 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Trinity1 wrote: |
Result - 1945 / 6 Million Dead
2007 - (With a nuclear Iran) possibly 7 million |
Are you saying that Muslims have killed 7 million Jews or that one day they might?
And by the way, if you want to find some interesting parallels, read chapter 6 of Mein Kampf and compare Hitler's tips for wartime propaganda to what the Bush Administration pulled prior to the invasion of Iraq...
There the similarities go well beyond just the title.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3123
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 5:12 am Post subject: |
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| P1234567890 wrote: | | Trinity1 wrote: |
Result - 1945 / 6 Million Dead
2007 - (With a nuclear Iran) possibly 7 million |
Are you saying that Muslims have killed 7 million Jews or that one day they might? |
Hitler told the world what he was going to do if he wielded that much power. He practically spelled it out for us. In the end, 6 million Jews went into the ovens.
Amadenijihad has essentially said the same thing. Once he has the capability, the Jews and Israel are going to be wiped out. Meaning, once he has the nuke (as he already has the means of delivery) it goes. He'll fabricate a crisis, demand that Israel leave or face the judgment of Allah, state it is part of jihad, and next thing you know, Tehran is missing from the geography of northern Iran... as Israel and the Jews refuse to get back into the 'ovens' and will launch on this guy and those like him.
_________________
Exodus 20:11 "For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them..."
‘The German Führer, as I have consistently maintained, is an evolutionist; he has consciously sought to make the practice of Germany conform to the theory of evolution.’ Sir Arthur Keith |
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Pondering
King of the Jungle
Joined: 15 Sep 2005
Posts: 1512
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 5:29 am Post subject: |
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Folks...the threat is real....The West is so fat, dumb, and happy (Socialist ideology coupled with Consumerism) that we are tearing ourselves apart internally with self-loathing...
meanwhile...the enemy is doing this
Using Western icons (Mickey Mouse) to teach hate to a whole new generation...
Iran grabs British soldiers...and we do nothing.
Knowing the "mistake" of Vietnam and then actively working to enact the same kind of pull-out...despite things like this
(al-Queda plot to bomb a girl's school)
At campuses across this country, Muslim student groups (funded largely by Saudi Arabia) are actively pursuing "special rights" programs under our concept of multiculturalism to enact sexist and racist programs that demonstrate the willingness of our social liberals to accept dhimmitude. link
In France, the socialist candidate warns of riots if she's not elected...she isn't...and guess what? RIOTS!
In answer to the question "Can't we all just get along?" I think the answer is no...
_________________
Links of note:"Review for Doubting Christians"
Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs
“You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong...You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves.” - Ronald Reagan |
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3123
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 6:57 am Post subject: |
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| Pondering wrote: | | Folks...the threat is real....The West is so fat, dumb, and happy (Socialist ideology coupled with Consumerism) that we are tearing ourselves apart internally with self-loathing... |
I think I referenced the book "Londistan" some other time, or in some other thread.
The book specifically describes what is/has occurred in London just as you stated. They are/were so worried about 'offending' the Muslims that they ended up not enforcing basic immigration laws, conducting proper searches and seizures, and essentially allowed any perceived ethnic minority to run nilly willy over them out based on some type of 'guilt of being in the majority complex'.
What happened is frightening, and is indeed real. Whether we want to acknowledge it or is irrelevant. These folks want to follow the example their glorious prophet set... and doesn't include 'getting along'. It includes hacking the heads off of those who won’t accept the idea that ‘there is only one god and Mohamed is his prophet’, or, subjugating them to second class citizenship and forcing them to pay ‘protection money’ (jizya – “tax”) to have the ‘honor’ of living in their presence and at their pleasure.
At one point I thought that Islam needed a ‘reformation’ of sorts… but, after a little more digging, I figured out that there is no reforming it… all these folks are doing is following the example set and articulated by Mo.
_________________
Exodus 20:11 "For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them..."
‘The German Führer, as I have consistently maintained, is an evolutionist; he has consciously sought to make the practice of Germany conform to the theory of evolution.’ Sir Arthur Keith
Last edited by Trinity1 on Tue May 08, 2007 7:19 am; edited 1 time in total |
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45degreeN
King Kong
Joined: 02 Aug 2005
Posts: 2673
Location: Salem Oregon
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 6:58 am Post subject: |
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Pondering wrote: | Quote: | Knowing the "mistake" of Vietnam and then actively working to enact the same kind of pull-out...despite things like this
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Just what was the mistake of vietnam?
For me just getting into Vietnam in the first place was the mistake, just like getting into Iraq.
So each requires us to exit somehow, the only decision to make is how many deaths do we need before we figure it out ? Vietnam took over 50,000 I sincerely hope that Iraq doesn't require than many!
_________________
My boss is a Jewish carpenter.
Read the
www.Christian-Thinktank.com |
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3123
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 7:36 am Post subject: |
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| dim12trav wrote: | | Pondering wrote: | Knowing the "mistake" of Vietnam and then actively working to enact the same kind of pull-out...despite things like this
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Just what was the mistake of vietnam?
For me just getting into Vietnam in the first place was the mistake, just like getting into Iraq. |
Fighting communist expansionism is a mistake? Fighting Islamic fascism is a mistake? I think the mistake Pondering is referring to here is allowing politicians to play 'politics' with the lives of our soldiers.
| Quote: | | So each requires us to exit somehow, the only decision to make is how many deaths do we need before we figure it out ? Vietnam took over 50,000 I sincerely hope that Iraq doesn't require than many! |
Not to mention the millions that died after we pulled out... or the millions that have suffered under the rule of the Pol Pot... the Communists... etc....
I think what you are refusing to acknowledge here is that there is indeed a price to pay for freedom… and occasionally folks need to ‘anny up’. No one likes it… no one agrees with how to do it all the time, but what I do know is that the longer the debt goes unpaid… the higher the price becomes, and the compounded interest ends up destroying you.
_________________
Exodus 20:11 "For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them..."
‘The German Führer, as I have consistently maintained, is an evolutionist; he has consciously sought to make the practice of Germany conform to the theory of evolution.’ Sir Arthur Keith |
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Pondering
King of the Jungle
Joined: 15 Sep 2005
Posts: 1512
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 8:11 am Post subject: |
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| dim12trav wrote: |
Just what was the mistake of vietnam? |
Checking out before the game was over...
| dim12trav wrote: |
For me just getting into Vietnam in the first place was the mistake, just like getting into Iraq. |
That may be true...at the time, threat of the "spread of Communism" was feared as much as the spread of Naziism. Not wanting to choose appeasement (since tht worked out so well in the 1930s) the US chose to fight.
....but warfare is serious. Once a nation commits to armed conflict..it has 2 choices.
1) Fight and win
2) Lose
Note I don't say "Fight and lose"...because that really isn't a choice. If you fight and get defeated...well, at least you were TRYING TO WIN. There is no "I don't want to play anymore" in the real world. Warfare is essentially the contest between 2 opposing wills...The side that loses it's will is usually the side that loses the field of battle (yes there are exceptions...an army of 100,000 against 10 dudes will probably win  )...but for a nation like the US, the ONLY way to lose is to give up...internally.
That's what Bin Laden saw that prompted him to strike here...That's what we did in Vietnam. That's what we're doing today.
The sad truth is, most Americans are very happy with thier very comfortable lives...and when push comes to shove, little brown people don't matter as much as "us"...
Let me remind you, a Democratic President (Kennedy) escalated our Vietnam involvement (from advisor to combat ops), Johnson continued to further escalate it after the Gulf of Tonkin ('64-'68). In '69, Nixon began to "Vietnamize" the war by decreasing the US active combat role (mainly air, logistics, artillery, and planning support). Then, we decided...(a Democratic Congress BTW) "so long, and thanks for all the fish!" The Peace Accord was supposed to leave 2 Vietnams. As soon as the US left..boom...chaos followed...horrors that are only now beginning to turn.
| dim12trav wrote: |
So each requires us to exit somehow, the only decision to make is how many deaths do we need before we figure it out ? Vietnam took over 50,000 I sincerely hope that Iraq doesn't require than many! |
Ok..for the 300th time...we lost 3 times more American lives in 1 month fighting for the island of Okinawa than we have in 4 years in Iraq and Afghanistan. Each of those lives is precious...but they were men and women of honor, serving in an all volunteer force...and they each gave their lives so other men might live free...
we leave and hundreds of thousands will die or suffer under the continuing oppression of dictatorial regimes...THAT'S why Syria, Iran, Saudia Arabia, Egypt, and the rest of the Muslim world WANTS US TO FAIL...and the Dhimmicrats are playing into their hands for short-term political gains...it's disgusting.
_________________
Links of note:"Review for Doubting Christians"
Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs
“You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong...You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves.” - Ronald Reagan |
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3123
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 10:46 am Post subject: |
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| Pondering wrote: | | and the Dhimmicrats are playing into their hands for short-term political gains...it's disgusting. |
I think I'm going to plagiarize this term! I love the originality and play on subjugation and democrat... too funny. Interesting how others aren’t picking up on it.
_________________
Exodus 20:11 "For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them..."
‘The German Führer, as I have consistently maintained, is an evolutionist; he has consciously sought to make the practice of Germany conform to the theory of evolution.’ Sir Arthur Keith |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8326
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Trinity1 wrote: | | Pondering wrote: | | and the Dhimmicrats are playing into their hands for short-term political gains...it's disgusting. |
I think I'm going to plagiarize this term! I love the originality and play on subjugation and democrat... too funny. Interesting how others aren’t picking up on it. |
I can't believe that you think Republicans are somehow better than Democrats... They BOTH suck!
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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45degreeN
King Kong
Joined: 02 Aug 2005
Posts: 2673
Location: Salem Oregon
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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And to win? Would Iraq look like America?
Fat chance of that happening. In a country where there has never been a true democracy we expect a democratic government to pop up and proclaim its rights. Hardly.
In fact we've been the very ones who have in the past supported the repressive regime, and now we're going to change all of that with the wave of a wand? No.
Unless the Iraqis do it for themselves, and it doesn't look like it, there will still be another dictatorship in the making. Some strong man taking the reigns of power and ruling with an iron fist. The last one we put into power (Saddam) when he disobeyed we threw him out and had him killed. If it was our country in the first place then we might have that right but it isn't our country it belongs to the Iraqis.
Forget winning and losing those terms are irrelevant to Americas role in this mess. It is the Iraqis who win or lose and so far they've not gotten their choice because we wont let them.
_________________
My boss is a Jewish carpenter.
Read the
www.Christian-Thinktank.com |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8326
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2007 4:24 am Post subject: |
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Very good post dim12!
Nobody ever even asked if it's POSSIBLE to IMPOSE democracy onto a country. As far as I know, it is unprecedented in history.
I argue that it's probably impossible to take a people who have no idea what democracy is, and have absolutely no history of democracy in their society and culture, and in fact have a religion which is completely incompatible with democracy, and then try to get them to establish a democratic society...
It just seems totally far-fetched, and is just another example of how delusional the Bush White House is.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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Pondering
King of the Jungle
Joined: 15 Sep 2005
Posts: 1512
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2007 4:41 am Post subject: |
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Fair point....but what's the other alternative?
We went to war to remove a despot. When given the choice between free societies and despotism, individuals universally choose free societies. Normally, the process is evolutionary (like North America and Western Europe)...
Iraq was an opportunity to "jump start" the process. To do that would require direct and continued US assistance, training, supporting, advising, etc....We could have taken the Japanese model (write their Constitution, choose their leaders, write their school curriculum....but didn't).
Against this effort are a) Political Despots (Syria, Saudi Arabia, Iran, former ruling Iraqi Baathists) and b) Religious Despots (Iran, al-Queda).
I find it difficult to understand how free living Westerners, Christians and Libertarians alike, are basically saying "screw them"....
_________________
Links of note:"Review for Doubting Christians"
Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs
“You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong...You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves.” - Ronald Reagan |
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