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45degreeN
King Kong
Joined: 02 Aug 2005
Posts: 2534
Location: Salem Oregon
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 Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 6:42 am Post subject: |
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All of you have completely missed the point about the faith of atheists. They just dont receive in their minds nor can they see the same evidence we Christians see and hear and in an absence of evidence they choose the rational and yet unchristian ways of atheism. (At least the rational ones do it this way, no accounting for the irrational ones)
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My boss is a Jewish carpenter.
Read the
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Silver Surfer
King Kong
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 2963
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 6:48 am Post subject: |
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| Siam wrote: | | Silver Surfer wrote: | | Siam wrote: | Just remember to Love your neighbor as you love your self...
So love your self. :D |
Kind of impossible for man/woman to do without God....being that man's basic nature is selfishness.
17:9 The heart [is] deceitful above all [things], and desperately wicked: who can know it ? |
God is love...sheesh. :roll:
Anyway thats the test your talking about isn't it. To overcome our flaws and move closer to paradise/God/Love.
Peace :D |
God's Love is mixed with God's Justice.
God's love will avenge the wrongs done to the innocent.
God's love WILL NOT protect the guilty, from their punishment.
God may love the person He punishes, even if He has to send them to Hell-Fire.
BUT, it is God's love that obeys the wishes of the guilty, that they receive eternal punishment.
God sets before mankind, eternal life or eternal death.....and it is up to the person to decide where they will end up.
God only honors that choice, that they have made.
As He has said: 18:23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: [and] not that he should return from his ways, and live ?
33:11 Say unto them, [As] I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die ?
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Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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Dust
Growing Lion
Joined: 10 Sep 2004
Posts: 890
Location: All over the western U.S.
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 7:24 am Post subject: |
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| Ana wrote: | | This is the sort of thing that supports what I'm saying about not being able to think outside your own little bubble. |
Ana,
We are both in little bubbles, I may not, at this time, be able to see all things from the 'Ana perspective' or see life through the 'Ana prisim', but from my religious POV, one day your perspective, whether it is right or wrong, from a negitive sense and/or through a positive sense, will benefit all mankind.....along with the life and experiences of each and every person that has ever lived.
Ana, evil, wrong, and confusing things must come into the world, things that create pain, anger, bitterness, and strife, or things that simply draw us towards ambivalence, or turn us against what is good, but woe to the man through whom these things come. That's how I see things in my bubble anyway.
_________________
The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen. |
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FFT
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 6067
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 8:49 am Post subject: |
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| Dust wrote: | Hello FFT,
You mean to tell me, in the face of contrary evidence, you are going to maintain your beliefs?
I guess it's true........What comes around goes around! |
What? Where did I say this?
_________________
When Science was in its crib, Religion tried to strangle it. When Science was in its infancy, Religion tried to abuse it. Now that Science is grown up, Religion wants to be in its good graces.
Theology is philosophy/ethics for people who already know what conclusion they want to come to. |
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Dust
Growing Lion
Joined: 10 Sep 2004
Posts: 890
Location: All over the western U.S.
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:16 am Post subject: |
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Howdy FFT,
Your stated belief is that atheism is it not abnormal. This is contrary to what the statistical facts indicate.
_________________
The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen. |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| Silver Surfer wrote: |
...
God's Love is mixed with God's Justice.
God's love will avenge the wrongs done to the innocent.
God's love WILL NOT protect the guilty, from their punishment.
God may love the person He punishes, even if He has to send them to Hell-Fire.
BUT, it is God's love that obeys the wishes of the guilty, that they receive eternal punishment.
God sets before mankind, eternal life or eternal death.....and it is up to the person to decide where they will end up.
God only honors that choice, that they have made.
As He has said: 18:23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: [and] not that he should return from his ways, and live ?
33:11 Say unto them, [As] I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die ? |
SS!
That is awesome....
Except for that 'may' in 'God may love the person He punishes...'
God does Love every person he scourges or punishes or spanks or kills or etc:
Hebrews 12:
5And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children,
My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
6For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
Other than that 'may,' you are awefull, 'full' being more than that 'some' in awesome!smile
with Love and R,
atoz |
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Dust
Growing Lion
Joined: 10 Sep 2004
Posts: 890
Location: All over the western U.S.
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:32 am Post subject: |
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Isaiah 26:9
My soul yearns for you in the night; in the morning my spirit longs for you. When your judgments come upon the earth, the people of the world learn righteousness.
_________________
The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen. |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:39 am Post subject: |
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| 45degreeN wrote: | | All of you have completely missed the point about the faith of atheists. They just dont receive in their minds nor can they see the same evidence we Christians see and hear and in an absence of evidence they choose the rational and yet unchristian ways of atheism. (At least the rational ones do it this way, no accounting for the irrational ones) |
Hi 45N,
But all Love comes from God since God is Love and His supreme Law for all words is Love. Matthew 22:36-40; 5:43-48.
So any Love atheists have comes from God and means that they also have the same Love by which the same faith in xtians works...Gal 5:6....even tho it may a thimblefull....which is why God says the satanic atheists with their LITTLE Love go in to heaven before the xtian theists who do right but with hearts filled with their MUCH Hate for the satanic atheists: Luke 18:9-14.
This is HOW God looks on the heart of each person: to see what Love or Hate there is in there, and who is focued in that Love or in the Hate in there. 1 samuel 16:7
It is the Hatred in their hearts by which atheists choose the rational yet Hateful ways in atheism that re-messes them up..........
JUST AS Xtians choose the rational yet Hateful ways in theism...as when Xtians hate which enemies God says to love: Matt 5:43-48:
irrationally hating rational and human and spiritual enemies,
irrationally hating irrational human and spiritual enemies which enemies are irrational by their own irrational Hatred of the irrational,
and
irrationally hating any word or person or being or place or thing while trying to love God as all words or as unconditionally.
In The rationality of God's Love for the rational and the irrational, the theist and atheist, the faithful & faithless,
atoz |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:51 am Post subject: |
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| Silver Surfer wrote: |
| Siam wrote: | Just remember to Love your neighbor as you love your self...
So love your self.  |
Kind of impossible for man/woman to do without God....being that man's basic nature is selfishness.
17:9 The heart [is] deceitful above all [things], and desperately wicked: who can know it ? |
That is, SS, seeing that man's nature as taught by his parents, guardians etc is self-HATE-ishness.
Ezekiel 16:
44Behold, every one that useth proverbs shall use this proverb against thee, saying,
As is the mother, so is her daughter.
45Thou art thy mother's daughter, that lotheth her husband and her children; and thou art the sister of thy sisters, which lothed their husbands and their children: your mother was an Hittite, and your father an Amorite.
Human Nature is naturally loving as designed by God:
1 Corinthians 14:
20Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children,
but in understanding be men.
Matthew 18
1At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying,
Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?
2And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them,
3And said,
Verily I say unto you, Except ye be con-verted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
In the Love that knows the deceit of Hatred of self and of others as self, as taught by other deceived humans, in the human heart,
atoz |
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atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:52 am Post subject: |
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| Siam wrote: | | Silver Surfer wrote: | Atheists will be lost because they failed to ask honestly for God to reveal Himself, to them......which HE WILL DO, if asked with an honest heart to know.
Because Judgment Day, is a VERY BAD time to finally find out, that God exist !!!!! |
Oh...And Jesus has stood in front of you S.S. and gone "Hay dude it's me. Put your your finger in my wound."
I am not an athiest, I have a deep belief in "God" (Loving universe) but I can understand athiest's belief in science much more than the belief that:
God is a man and that he sent his son to earth, who by the way, is that same God, even though he talks to a Father, who by the way is God or Jesus, who tells us to love the Lord, who by the way, is him, or the Father or God, who "Died for our sin's" which dosn't mean we are saved because, after hanging around for 7000 plus generations in the sky watching us all kill our selves, we must have "faith" that he exists and those that do he will make a special little place for in the kingdom of heaven, which by the way, we are supposed to make on earth, (I'm sure thats beside the point) while he will send all those non-believers to eternal hell damnation. 
God is all.
Peace.
Siam. |
Well said, Siam!
with L&r,
atoz |
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FFT
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 6067
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 10:25 am Post subject: |
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| Dust wrote: | Howdy FFT,
Your stated belief is that atheism is it not abnormal. This is contrary to what the statistical facts indicate. |
Funny, here's what I actually said:
| FFT wrote: | | Dust wrote: | | I have to ask, given the overwhelming results of the statistics I listed earlier, why do you seem to dispute the finding, that atheism is not a normal mind set? |
Because it's retarded. You're trying to say or at least imply that there's something wrong with atheists, which is false. Atheism is not normal in the US, no, but in certain parts of the USA it is. In some other countries it is.
Your statistics are irrelevant. |
Did I say that atheism was not, on the whole, abnormal? No. I pointed out that there's a sampling bias: while it's true that the world as a whole is religious, this is more true in certain places than others. You appear to be implying that atheism is wrong or that there is something wrong with atheists, which is not supported by statistics any more than the implication that there is something wrong with Jews because they are a statistical rarity. For the record, the nonreligious make up ~1.1 billion of the world population. About half of those are theists, leaving us with roughly 500 million atheists. That's more than Buddhism, indegenous, Judaism; basically every religion but Christianity, Islam, and Hinduism (and one could easily argue that they don't count since adherents of those religions are split into distinctly different sects—the largest in Christianity, Catholicism, has but 60 million adherents).
_________________
When Science was in its crib, Religion tried to strangle it. When Science was in its infancy, Religion tried to abuse it. Now that Science is grown up, Religion wants to be in its good graces.
Theology is philosophy/ethics for people who already know what conclusion they want to come to. |
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Silver Surfer
King Kong
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 2963
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:16 am Post subject: |
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God will answer any atheists prayer, for God to reveal Himself to them, if they are honestly seeking to know the truth.
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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FFT
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 6067
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:32 am Post subject: |
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Ahem. No.
I guess you probably honestly believe that (and will turn to discrediting me to defend your belief) but it's not true.
_________________
When Science was in its crib, Religion tried to strangle it. When Science was in its infancy, Religion tried to abuse it. Now that Science is grown up, Religion wants to be in its good graces.
Theology is philosophy/ethics for people who already know what conclusion they want to come to. |
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Dust
Growing Lion
Joined: 10 Sep 2004
Posts: 890
Location: All over the western U.S.
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 3:01 am Post subject: |
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Howdy FFT,
| FFT wrote: | | You appear to be implying that atheism is wrong |
I simply made an observation. You are the one who drew the 'wrong' connotation. Why blame me for that?
_________________
The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen. |
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Steven3
Lion King
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Posts: 1205
Location: UK
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 3:45 am Post subject: |
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| Dust wrote: | Howdy FFT,
| FFT wrote: | | You appear to be implying that atheism is wrong |
I simply made an observation. You are the one who drew the 'wrong' connotation. Why blame me for that? |
Dust, please scroll up the thread and look again. FFT is not "blaming" anyone, he's trying to get to you to see that you misread and possibly misrepresented what he said:
| FFT wrote: | | Atheism is not normal in the US, no, but in certain parts of the USA it is. In some other countries it is. |
He could have linked to: http://www.adherents.com/largecom/com_atheist.html | Dust wrote: | | Your stated belief is that atheism is it not abnormal. This is contrary to what the statistical facts indicate. |
All I see here is
1. Forumitis - misread something and never admit to having done so. We all do it, but if any of us always does it, it's a problem.
2. Majorityisrightitis - a variation on the same argument along the lines that the majority is always right, and I'm in the majority so I'm right, which seems to underpin so many confident assertions on this board, such (no pointing) as those that the Union and Confederacy didn't have the draft, that "the compilation and canonicity of Christian writings was entrusted to God's chosen", and most recently "that Evangelical Bible translations are policed by many with-in the main body-of-Christ...and these receive power and authority to do so from the Holy Spirit." and so on. Not arguments which win friends and influence people any more than "I'm bigger than you" does in the schoolyard.
God bless all
Steven
_________________
Jo5:26 The Father ... has granted the Son also to have life in himself.
Ro6:10 the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God.
2Co13:4 he was crucified in weakness, but lives by the power of God. |
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