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PARA + dative "in the sight of"

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Steven3
Lion King

Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Posts: 1205

Location: UK

Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2007 5:36 pm Post subject: PARA + dative "in the sight of"

PARA + dative

This is an exhaustive list of all NT uses. (I hope, I've checked twice).

The primary semantic divisions follow LSJ
entry for PARA in Liddle Scott

There's a slight mismatch between LSJ and NT usage - given that NT usage is Hellenistic (Alexander the Great onwards) and slightly coloured by Semitic usage, though more by the nature of monotheism than language perhaps. What that means is these NT uses don't neatly or equally dovetail into LSJ, and these semantic divisions are a simplification, and to some extent, like much lexical activity, arbitrary. I'm sure a professional lexicographer could have dovetailed LSJ and NT far better.

LSJ wrote:

B. WITH DAT. denoting rest by the side of any person or thing, answering the question where?

This is the grammatical subdivision "WITH DAT." means + dative case, as indicated by the inflection/declension of nouns and pronouns.

LSJ wrote:

I. of Places, kat' ar hezet' . . par puri, ekeito p. sêkôi, Od.7.154, 9.319; nemontai p. petrêi 13.408 ; hestaotes par ochesphin Il.8.565 ; par posi marnamenôn ekulindeto at their feet, 14.411, etc.; p. thurêisi at the door, 7.346; p. rhêgmini thalassês 2.773 ; deipnon . . heilonto par' ochthêisin potamoio Od.6.97 , cf. Il.4.475, 20.53, etc.; keisthai par' Haidêi S.OT972 ; par' oinôi over wine, ib. 780, etc.

= beside (object)
John 19:25 "and now there stood PARA the cross.."

Quote:

II. of persons, beside, par de hoi autôi heise Theoklumenon Od.15.285 ; keito para mnêstêi alochôi Il.9.556 , cf. 6.246, etc.; par' andrasin eunazesthai Od.5.119 ; dainusthai p. tini 8.243 ; par de hoi hestêkei stood by him, Il.4.367.

= alongside (person)
Luke 9:47 "But Jesus, knowing the reasoning of their hearts, took a child and put him by his side" (ESV) -------

{* I was honestly surprised when reviewing this to find only these 2 verses using the physical PARA+dative in the whole NT. This is mainly because NT Greek makes much more use of META+genitive, "with", for physical proximity, and non-physical, such as Matt1:23" Emmanuel, which being interpreted is God META us" .......... META+genitive "with" occurs c.500x in NT.}

= among (+ dative plural)
Matthew 28:15 So they took the money and did as they were directed. And this story has been spread PARA the Jews to this day. --- similarly Matt21:25 "reasoned AMONG themselves" Matt22:25 "AMONG us seven brothers".
Col 4:16 "when this letter is read PARA you (pl.)"
Rev2:13 "who was slain AMONG you"
[/i]

LSJ wrote:

2. at one's house or place, with one, menein p. tisi 9.427 ; thêteuemen allôi, andri par' aklêrôi Od.11.490 ; phileesthai p. tini Il.13.627 ; par' heôutoisi at their own house, Hdt.1.105, cf. 86; paideuthênai p. tini X.Cyr.1.2.15 ; kataluein p. tini D.18.82 (but para tina katalusai Th.1.136 ), etc.: hence hoi par' emoi those of my household, X.Mem.2.7.4, etc.; ta par' emoi life with me, Id.An. 1.7.4; hoi par' hêmin anthrôpoi our people, Pl.Phd.64b; hê par' hêmin politeia, ho par' humin dêmos, D.15.19; ho par' hautôi biotos one's own life, S.OT612; to par' hêmin pur Pl.Phlb.29f ; hosos par' humin ho phthonos phulassetai S.OT382 ; to par' hêmin sôma Pl.Phlb.29f ; also, in one's hands, ta p. tois Hellênotamiais onta IG12.91.6 ; echein par' heôutôi Hdt. 1.130 , etc.;

= at the house of, at the table of, cf. French chez
Luke 11:37 "asked him to dine PARA him"
Luke 19:7 "a dinner guest PARA a man that is a sinner"
John 1:39 He said to them, “Come and you will see.” So they came and saw where he was staying, and they lodged PARA him that day, for it was about the tenth hour.
John 4:40 "that he would lodge PARA them"
John 14:17 "for he dwells PARA you"
14:23 "make our mansion PARA you",
14:25 "present PARA you"
Acts 9:43 "lodged PARA Simon the tanner"
Acts 10:6, 32 "PARA Simon the tanner, whose house is by the seaside"
18:13,20 "he stayed PARA them"
21:7,8 "and stayed PARA them one day"
21:16 "PARA who we should lodge"
1Co7:24 "abide PARA God"
2Tim 4:13 "the coat I left at Troy PARA Carpus" (at Carpus' house, chez Carpus)

Quote:

oupô par' emoi tot' ên legein I had no right to speak then, Men.Epit.98.

= as for, for
Matthew 19:26 But Jesus looked at them and said, “PARA man this is impossible, but PARA God all things are possible.”
Luke 1:37 For nothing will be impossible FOR God.”
James 1:17 "PARA whom no changeing"

= reflexive
1Co16:12 "save up PARA yourselves"
2Co1:17 "PARA me, yes yes, no no"

LSJ wrote:

3. before, in the presence of, êeide p. mnêstêrsin Od. 1.154 ; before a judge, dikas gignesthai p. tôi polemarchôi IG12.16.9 ; p. Dareiôi kritêi Hdt.3.160 ; p. tôi basileï Id.4.65 ; para dikastais Th. 1.73 ; eis krisin kathistanai tina p. tisi D.18.13 : hence par' emoi in my judgement, Hdt.1.32, cf. S.Tr.589, E.Heracl.881, 1 Ep.Cor.3.19; p. toutôi mega dunêsetai with him, Pl.Grg.510e.

= in the sight of, before
Matthew 6:1 “Beware of practicing your righteousness before other people in order to be seen by them, for then you will have no reward PARA your Father who is in heaven.-------- PARA+dative in this use does not require disciples to be physically WITH, ALONGSIDE, their Father in heaven. The idea is the reward is on deposit, since, as Rev22 says, Christ brings the reward down with him when he returns.
Luke 1:30 "you have found favour PARA God" ---- Mary was not physically WITH, ALONGSIDE, God to acquire credit, favour, before him. She found credit IN THE SIGHT OF God.
Acts 26:8 "a thing incredible PARA you"
Ro.2:11 "no respect of persons PARA God"
2:13 "just PARA God"
Ro12:6 "be not wise PARA your own conceits"
1Co3:19 "foolishness PARA God"
Gal 3:11 "the law IN THE SIGHT of God" (KJV)
Eph 6:9 "no respect of persons PARA him"
2Th1:6 "a righteous thing PARA God"
James 1:27 Religion that is pure and undefiled PARA God, the Father, is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.
1Pe2:4 "chosen IN THE SIGHT OF God"
1Pe2:20 "acceptable PARA God"
2Pe2:11 "whereas angels, though greater in might and power, do not pronounce a blasphemous judgment against them BEFORE the Lord."
2Pe3:8 "day is as a thousand years PARA God"

LSJ wrote:

4. in quoting authors, par' Ephorôi, par' Aischinêi, p. Thoukudidêi, in Ephorus, etc., Plb. 9.2.4, D.H.Comp.9,18.

(no example in NT).

LSJ wrote:

III. Arc., = p. c. gen., from, katha eichon tas intolas p. tai idiai poli SIG559.9 (Megalop., iii B. C.), cf. 558.10 (Ithaca, iii B. C.).

(Archaic, too early for NT).

CONCLUSION
The physical use of PARA+dative to mean "alongside" "with" is rare in the NT (only the child alongside Jesus, the women alongside the cross). Why" Because in the NT META+genitive "with" (500x) covers that usage. "with God" generally means, as with Mary, finding favour IN THE SIGHT OF GOD, not physically being there.

The above list is complete except for the PARA+dative in this (disputed) verse:

John 17:5 And now, Father, glorify me PARA you
with the glory that I had PARA you before the world existed.

From the above it seems the most likely usage appears to be throneroom language, IN THE SIGHT OF, which does not (given that all things are in God's sight, and his foreknowledge, 1Pe1:21), require God to be physically proximate. It doesn't when used with a human king either (with the obvious difference that a human king can't see the future).

Nor does it require the person being given the grace, favour, glory, to even be born yet:

2 Timothy 1:9 who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began,

But that's another subject...
S
_________________
Jo5:26 The Father ... has granted the Son also to have life in himself.
Ro6:10 the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God.
2Co13:4 he was crucified in weakness, but lives by the power of God.

atoz
Emperor of the Solar System

Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 5:48 pm Post subject: Re: PARA + dative "in the sight of"

Steven3 wrote:

Re: PARA + dative "in the sight of"

.....S

Hi S3,

it is PARA + genitive that means 'in the sight of,'
genitive being 'of,'
dative being 'to' or 'for.'

in the Genitive & Ablative of God's Love Datively to & for you, smile
atoz

Steven3
Lion King

Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Posts: 1205

Location: UK

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 11:54 pm Post subject: Re: PARA + dative "in the sight of"

atoz wrote:

Steven3 wrote:

Re: PARA + dative "in the sight of"

.....S

Hi S3,

it is PARA + genitive that means 'in the sight of,'

Er, Atoz

How can I say this....? No.
God bless
S.
_________________
Jo5:26 The Father ... has granted the Son also to have life in himself.
Ro6:10 the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God.
2Co13:4 he was crucified in weakness, but lives by the power of God.

atoz
Emperor of the Solar System

Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189

Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 2:29 pm Post subject: Re: PARA + dative "in the sight of"

Steven3 wrote:

atoz wrote:

Steven3 wrote:

Re: PARA + dative "in the sight of"

.....S

Hi S3,

it is PARA + genitive that means 'in the sight of,'

Er, Atoz

How can I say this....? No.
God bless
S.

Er, S3!

HOW U can say and should say NO ...is in Love!smile

God Bless!
in the Nominative to the Ablative of Love,smile
atoz

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