 |
Bible-Discussion.com
Private Bible Studies and Christian Fellowship Available - Ask Nobby
|
|
|
| Author |
Message |
45degreeN
King Kong
Joined: 02 Aug 2005
Posts: 2672
Location: Salem Oregon
|
 Posted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 8:35 am Post subject: Are there people that God does not call? |
 |
|
In the parable of the four soils (especially in Mark 4) Jesus says that He spoke in parables so that people might listen and not understand.
Mark4:10 When he was alone, the Twelve and the others around him asked him about the parables. 11He told them, "The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables 12so that,
" 'they may be ever seeing but never perceiving,
and ever hearing but never understanding;
otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!"
"13Then Jesus said to them, "Don't you understand this parable? How then will you understand any parable?"
Does it not say that some people are just poor soil. That explaining the parable to them would not free them from their being poor soil but require constant tending just to their needs and no matter how much tending there still would not be any growth from them. Has Jesus just rejected them as candidates to receive the gospel? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
bitterlily
Big Pit Bull
Joined: 15 Jul 2007
Posts: 398
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 6:38 am Post subject: Re: Are there people that God does not call? |
|
|
| 45degreeN wrote: | In the parable of the four soils (especially in Mark 4) Jesus says that He spoke in parables so that people might listen and not understand.
Mark4:10 When he was alone, the Twelve and the others around him asked him about the parables. 11He told them, "The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables 12so that,
" 'they may be ever seeing but never perceiving,
and ever hearing but never understanding;
otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!"
"13Then Jesus said to them, "Don't you understand this parable? How then will you understand any parable?"
Does it not say that some people are just poor soil. That explaining the parable to them would not free them from their being poor soil but require constant tending just to their needs and no matter how much tending there still would not be any growth from them. Has Jesus just rejected them as candidates to receive the gospel? |
Hello 45degreeN,
My personal (scriptured) opinion is No. If my Mum thought like that, God knows where I would have ended up. But with great patience and a nonjudgemental attitude and unconditional love my mother lived to see her wayward child see the light. She even told me she used to get a bit worried about me at times, doubting whether her christian virtue had any power in leading me to the Lord. I was able to tell her after the fact, that she had been for me the greatest example of Jesus I had ever known. It was the thought of living without her love that had me running into the arms of the Lord.
So yes even very poor soil with thorns and weeds and chemical waste can be replenished. One example that comes to mind are the Israelites. They could be considered as being poor soil back in the day, and the Apostle Paul (I think it was) said that they were cut off so that gentiles could be grafted in, but once the fulness of the gentiles have come in, all Israel will be saved.
Are you having problems sowing seeds in someones field(heart). If so, don't despair. There maybe many issues as to why those seeds are not taking root. If you know anything about gardening you will know that it is important to prepare the ground first. Due to the invisible nature of our hearts (fields), God is really the only one qualified for this job. And though you may not see it, he may be working on that person right now, possibly ploughing the ground or gently working at some weeds with deep roots. Another possibility is that he is using this person to work on your soil a little more. If your trying to sow seeds I would suggest you wait on the Lord and ask to be shown when the soil of that person is ready to have a few seeds scattered upon it. And in the meantime just focus on loving the person. I think most of us wish that love could be a short sprint to the finish line but love is a long distance endurance race as my mum discovered with me. My conversion has given her the faith to trust that her other 5 children will turn to the Lord in time too. And I will add they are closer than they were 7 years ago, often asking me different questions about what the Bible teaches. When I give them a few verses that come to my mind, they are often pleasantly surprised and I see the sparkle in their eyes. This is very different to when I first came to the Lord, it was as if their sister had been turned into a frog (it was very depressing).
The Lords desire is that none should be lost and all would come to the knowledge of the truth. Some people for one reason or another take a lot longer than others. But if you look at nature, it is true of all plants and trees. Who knows maybe the people you have in mind are destined to be huge trees in the Lord. You never know. Keep the faith.
Cheers
Bitterlily  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
knuckle
Young Wolf
Joined: 18 Sep 2006
Posts: 501
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 11:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hi--------
Good post bitterlily.
Tom,I believe the whole field was bought to get the treasure.At the end of the day both are still His.
much love---------knuckle |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 7005
Location: USA
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 3:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I think the question is not really the question:
"Are there people that God does not call?"
The answer is simple: No, there are none that He does not call.
Is that really the question to be asked? It occurs to me that a more thorough answer is: No there are none that He does not call, but there are absolutely those who do not hear, or even refuse to hear, that call.
_________________
JP's Mind - my blog
Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Steven3
Lion King
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Posts: 1205
Location: UK
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 4:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hi
God certainly wants, commands, which is a form of call.
Acts 17:30 ...now he commands all people everywhere to repent
1 Timothy 2:4 who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Though it appears that God does not force/enforce the calling, even with those who have believed, repented and been baptised:
2 Peter 1:10 Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to make your calling and election sure, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall.
God bless
Steven
_________________
Jo5:26 The Father ... has granted the Son also to have life in himself.
Ro6:10 the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God.
2Co13:4 he was crucified in weakness, but lives by the power of God. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
45degreeN
King Kong
Joined: 02 Aug 2005
Posts: 2672
Location: Salem Oregon
|
| Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 6:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
Romans 9 | Quote: | 15For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
17For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
18Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
19Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
20Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
21Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: |
This tells me that there are some created for destruction and never meant to be saved. Of course this verse is widely used by Calvinists who emphasize this over other verses, that might show something else.
_________________
My boss is a Jewish carpenter.
Read the
www.Christian-Thinktank.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
apocatastasis
King of the Jungle
Joined: 15 Feb 2004
Posts: 1827
|
| Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 12:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| RevivedJP wrote: | | ....there are absolutely those who do not hear, or even refuse to hear, that call. |
And that includes everyone (Romans 3:11).
_________________
"Overcome anger by love. Overcome evil by good. Overcome the miser by giving. Overcome the liar by truth." |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bitterlily
Big Pit Bull
Joined: 15 Jul 2007
Posts: 398
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:49 pm Post subject: Re: Are there people that God does not call? |
|
|
| apocatastasis wrote: | | RevivedJP wrote: | | ....there are absolutely those who do not hear, or even refuse to hear, that call. |
And that includes everyone (Romans 3:11). |
What I had hoped to highlight in my response to 45degreeN was that it is not up to us to JUDGE the quality of an individual's soil. That point obviously got lost in translation.
_________________
In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink. He that believes on me, as the scripture has said, out of his heart shall flow rivers of living water. Joh 7:37-38
As a lily among thorns, So is my love among the daughters. Son 2:2 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Nyack 1964
Newbie Alert
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Posts: 2
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 4:51 pm Post subject: Are all called or are some rejected without being called |
|
|
God stated
ASV 6 Behold, I will bring it health and cure, and I will cure them; and I will reveal unto them abundance of peace and truth.
Jer 33:6 (ASV)
If God wants to demonstrate his anger and reveal his power, he can do it. But can't he be extremely patient with people who are objects of his anger because they are headed for destruction? 23 Can't God also reveal the riches of his glory to people who are objects of his mercy and who he had already prepared for glory? 24 This is what God did for us whom he called—whether we are Jews or not.
Romans 9:22-24 (GW)
For God’s wrath is ever being revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who smother the truth by their unrighteousness.
19 This is so because that which may be known of God is manifest among them; for God has made it manifest to them.
20 For ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, even his everlasting power and divinity, has been clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made. So they have no excuse.
Romans 1:18-20 (MontgomeryNT)
According to scripture God has revealed himself through Creation. All are subject to it. All are called,.... some just let it go to voicemail.
He stands at the door and knocks (of all . implied) We just need to answer AND, this is the most important part, let him in. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
atoz
Emperor of the Solar System
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 4189
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 6:55 pm Post subject: Re: Are there people that God does not call? |
|
|
| 45degreeN wrote: | | Are there people that God does not call? |
atoz: Yes, there are people that God does not call at one time or another.
2 Corinthians 6:2
(For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is [A] day of salvation.)
But He ultimately wants to call all and will call all.
And like Uncle Sam, when he wants them, he gets them.
Romans 11:
26And so all Israel shall be saved:
as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
1 Timothy 2: 1
I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
2For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
in Love for all that gest all saved by God who is Love,
atoz |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
FAQ 
Search 
Make a Donation 
Usergroups 
Contact
Register
Submit Articles 
Log in to check your private messages 
