Lies

Pondering · King of the Jungle Joined: 15 Sep 2005 Posts: 1506

and again...I say "irrational"...you're smarter than this to come this kind of conclusion...

for heaven's sake, if he wanted a war just to enrich himself (or his company) he would've picked an easier country to defeat, like France Wink

or Canada

Yes, I see a conflict of interest...and so did he...he did everything the law requires to divest himself....which is more than Sen Feinstein did in a similar situation....

Do I think Cheney's a little wacky? Yes. Do I think he managed to move the entire country/government to war in order to make himself rich? I don't watch X-File, Lost, or Conspiracy Theories R Us...so....no.
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P1234567890 · Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 6:17 am Post subject:

I'm not saying that enriching himself was his ONLY motivation for going to war, but he definitely knew that war was going to make him a VERY rich man, and I can't believe that you don't think that's a SERIOUS conflict of interest.
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"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous.

45degreeN · Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 6:38 am Post subject:

Whew such long posts... give me a break folks (just kidding)

As to an American Empire, call it whatever you want but American influence and subtle control of other countries is what I think of in addition to the massive amounts of our military spread all around the world. Even our friends in Europe (Eurabia) feel the "love" from us on a regular basis.

Rejection of this influence governs many other countries politics, even though it falls on deaf ears most of the time. The Islamic world at least has something that they can point to and say they've been successful to a point at least. Look at Indonesia and their Islamic population the largest Islamic country's population in the world. What possible connection do they have with a desert culture? Indonesia has been oppressed by the west for centuries for commercial gain. As an Islamic culture they can offer some resistance/rejection of the west.

To think that we dont have an empire just because we dont call it such is ignoring the facts.
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Pondering · King of the Jungle Joined: 15 Sep 2005 Posts: 1506

no, words are important and that's what I'm arguing about...

The US is not an Imperial power.

It IS a superpower or more correctly a hegemon

Although one could argue that the US is "highly influential" vice "dominant"....
_________________
Links of note:"Review for Doubting Christians"
Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs
“You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong...You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves.” - Ronald Reagan

P1234567890 · Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 7:36 am Post subject:

So you'd rather be called a hegemony than an imperial power? Fine by me... Six of one, half a dozen of the other.

How come you're splitting hairs on this subject, but on the topic of Cheney's making literally a hundred million dollars on the Iraq war, you brush it off as if it totally doesn't matter?
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous.

45degreeN · Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 8:51 am Post subject:

The US has hidden behind the skirts of commercial interests when "invading" other cultures with our dreck. There certainly is cultural imperialism going on. It seems our government is willing to financially help out even huge corporations with hand outs if they invade some third world country with their "burgers and fries" or demand they buy our planes for their airlines and or airforce. Mc Donalds and Boeing both have received huge payouts from the government in this effort.

The world bank (mostly US controlled) has offered huge amounts of money for other countries to build dams or otherwise alter their economy so that American interests can come into and control/subvert them. It all amounts to the same thing. US imperialism. (cultural and economic)

In the 19th century we sent missionaries into those same countries with their hoopskirts and buttoned down jackets, fully clothed into tropical climates to impose our dress code upon them. We in the west have been imposing our values on them since then.
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Colter · Rabid Pit Bull Joined: 20 Mar 2007 Posts: 409

LoL! 911 is America's fault, if we hadn't put our boots on the soil of the Saudis, (who asked us to) Osama would have never done what he did. (Never mind that Islamic terrorist have been attacking American asset's for years)

The left wing apologists of Osama and every other enemy of America are constitutionally incapable of holding people accountable for their own behavior. The exception to this is anyone perceived as conservative. They have no problem holding conservatives responsible for every ill known to mankind.

This morning some idiot walked into Virginia Tech and started killing kids, as of now 22 dead and 21 injured. Tomorrow the left wing loonies will begin to hold someone other then the shooter responsible. I will compile a list and lets see what the left wing media comes up with.

* The gun manufacturer

* George Bush

* the war on terror hurt the shooters feelings

* global warming....brought on by republicans

* the American civil war

* tax breaks for those who pay them

* affordable housing

* conservative talk radio

* Christianity

Anyone can add to the list.

Colter
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Micah denounced "the rulers who judge for reward and the priests who teach for hire and the prophets who divine for money." He taught of a day of freedom from superstition and priestcraft, saying: "But every man shall sit under his own vine, and no one shall make him afraid, for all people will live, each one according to his understanding of God."

P1234567890 · Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:15 am Post subject:

How come you want to oversimplify things so much? There are MANY reasons behind the shooting. Obviously the shooter bears the lion's share of the blame, but there are many factors which you're completely ignoring, including your country's crazy gun laws and your country's crazy gun culture and culture of violence.

Who knows; maybe the guy was crazy and just didn't get his medication because like many people in your country, he didn't have health care coverage. You've got NO IDEA what the circumstances surrounding the shootings are, so don't be so quick to assign the blame EXCLUSIVELY on the shooter.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous.

Colter · Rabid Pit Bull Joined: 20 Mar 2007 Posts: 409

P1234567890 · Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 10:28 am Post subject:

See how simplistic your viewpoint is?

Your country really does have crazy gun laws, and it really does have a crazy gun-culture, and both of those things DEFINITELY contribute to having shootings like the one today.

No other civilized country on the planet has gun laws as liberal as yours, and consequently no other civilized country on the planet has a gun murder rate nearly as high as yours. Do you realize that in many states it's possible for a teenager to LEGALLY buy a gun than it is to go dancing at a nightclub? How messed up is that?!?

And do you realize that American culture is by far the most violent one in any civilized country on Earth? The sight of Janet Jackson's nipple was enough to cause a major firestorm in the media, but the average American child has seen literally tens of thousands of violent acts (including thousands of murders with guns) by the time they're 18?

Your educational system and folk lore creates heroes out of men such as Davy Crocket, who was essentially just a violent dude. Your government ROUTINELY sends the message that it's ok to settle disputes by resorting to violence...

...So yes, there's A LOT more behind the shooting today than you'd like to believe. How come you don't ever see any shootings like that in, say, Japan or Great Britain or Sweden?
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous.

45degreeN · Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 10:44 am Post subject:

Can we get back to cultural imperialism and have a different thread for the shootings?
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www.Christian-Thinktank.com

Colter · Rabid Pit Bull Joined: 20 Mar 2007 Posts: 409

P1234567890 · Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:38 am Post subject:

P1234567890 · Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:40 am Post subject:

Colter · Rabid Pit Bull Joined: 20 Mar 2007 Posts: 409