God cares?

firegreen · Tadpole Joined: 03 Feb 2007 Posts: 16

ok if there is a god and he did create us like it says in that book that we read that is loosley translated from a dead language, then why create mans partner from himself. i personally dont believe a word of this creation story, sounds a little far fetched for me. why would an all powerful being give us free will then tell us we can and cant do certain things, and that if we do them we will burn in hellfire? the reason people think that homosexual acts are wrong is because of the years of brainwashing by the church, im mean thousands of years. when in actuality everyday in the animal kingdom, which we are a part of (fact), there are animals instictually acting homosexual, which according to christianity, is not instictual. kinda weird huh? fact of the matter here is from my expert point of view if there was a god, he/she/it wouldnt care about your sexual orientation.

Religion....Mans devestating mistake-Jason Clark

P1234567890 · Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:50 am Post subject: Re: God cares?

lone-traveler · Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 6:23 am Post subject:

Hi firegreen,

And what I'm about to say is my opinion. And is not intended against anyone.

The one thing that you wrote that stuck out the most to me was that even animals have homosexual relations.
While this may be true, I believe that mankind should consider themselves more advanced than the animals.
And that the reason I believe man was told to not have homosexual relations is for the very reason that we see manifesting today. Disease to ones body.

The OT in my opinion has to do with the care and well being of the body, where the NT has to do with the heart and mind.
There is only a verse or two that gives warning about such relations that come from the heart and mind.
Can homosexuality cause a lack of growth in one's spiritual walk?
I don't know. But it may in others.
If I say to you, it's better for you to refrain from doing this because it may cause you physical death...then it is considered a "judgement" call on my part.
That I'm judging whether you have faith in God according to how you use your body. So that comes down to works of the law.
Is it because I don't believe you have faith? or is it because we have been told that this is not the right way to hmm..work your body?

Is it through compassion and concern that one doesn't want to see another take a chance on their health?
The same goes for prostitution, switching partners, because the chances of contracting a disease is far greater.

A lot of the laws in the bible are for our own good. So that we remain healthy and take less chances at getting diseases.
And maybe the fear of the old testament is exactly what we see today, millions of people infected and dying and so it was to be prevented at all cost. Not only for those who were not in that lifestyle, but those who were heading that way.

If I was to say, if you do this thing then you will be taken outside the camp and stoned. Would it deter you? would you fear for your life that you would be killed?
Yet that fear of being stoned may have saved your life from many years of sickness and disease...and the rest of the people would not have been subjected to it either.

I can understand the reasoning and the measures that were taken to prevent some awful things from happening. But the way some people go about explaining seems harsh and judgmental. But in fact sometimes you have to be tough to prevent a worse thing from happening.

Maybe putting the fear into someone is truly an act of love.

In the OT it does not say that if you are guilty that you will burn forever in hellfire. It says you will be stoned.
In the NT it is your mind that gets burned..the body profits nothing.
It's the conscience that is seared with a hot iron, because while doing something that seems good in ones own eyes, may not be good for the whole world.
If you knew that you were the first one to put this rapid disease into play...would you still do whatever it was you wanted to do..if you could see in the future all the men women and children being destroyed because of a personal desire...would you still do it?

And maybe this is where the conscience comes into play. That knowing that doing such things can cause such catasrophe later on..still find pleasure doing it anyways.

And my final opinion would be..
Do whatever it is you want to do, but please take every precaution to avoid taking chances with other peoples lives.
I am not your judge, I am your friend.
And only out of love do I warn you from what has already been witnessed by what has happened to others.

Mankind is supposed to be more intelligent than animalkind..
Let's not lower ourselves to the lusts of an animal. Maybe they don't get the diseases..but people sure do.
Just think about your neighbour...sometimes it could save your own life.

Peace
Lone

hey P123...I hear you man..
practice what I preach.. Confused or disgusted

kick the habit.. Confused or disgusted

some evils just don't appear as evil as others huh?
but it's all the same.. Sad

not much difference between homosexuality and smoking.
Both of them can kill you and those around you...
I'm listening..
God Bless
Lone
_________________
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

FFT · Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:26 am Post subject:

lone-traveler · Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 9:03 am Post subject:

because we rebel against good teaching.

And I'm not getting into the animal sacrifices..
There's a lot in those laws that no one is willing to honestly look at and see what doing or not doing certain things mean in the long term.
They weren't meant to give people a right to hammer and kill people with stones, but to deter them from harming themselves or the community in some way.
Some laws God says he gave that were not good. There are laws in there that only are there to weed out those that follow them because they are easily led into whatever they're told. And others are for real and true correction and teaching.

Why did God tell them not to combine wool and linen...
There are meanings within this that have nothing to do with the wool and the linen..but when you start pulling apart the threads you are given a deeper understanding than the clothes themselves.
A lot of the laws were given for "sign" what to stay away from and beware of...and it also kept them seperate from the world around them.
How many other peoples were seperating wool and linen? probably not many if any.
The wool belongs to the sheep and the linen belongs to the priests. The priests were given the linen because they were not supposed to sweat....no sweat, keep cool...

They were there to calm the sheep..the sheep sweat it out and the priests kept their cool..LOL..

You can take any law and say..what the heck was that for? that's stupid...ok but because we don't understand why they were given or how they were applied, then to us they become nothing more than someones way to dictate and rule with no common sense in mind.

But some of them understood. Some of them knew that the laws represented them. If they could read the writing, they might be able to see themselves..alas many just saw what was written and didn't apply it to themselves.

I believe that's why God gave them the law. So that by it and through it, it would be a witness of themselves and who they were.
As you go on through the bible and you watch the temple being built, you can see how they were deteriorating on the inside even though they were glorious on the outside.

Ahh..FFT so hard to look under the writing and see the heart of the matter.

where were the diseases to begin with? where did they come from?
A lot of the food laws of clean and unclean came into play here. They didn't have the "science" we have today.
A lot of the diseases were already in the world around them.
God didn't cause Aids or any other diseases. But man creates the diseases themselves by eating and doing things that are not good for the body to eat and do.

If a monkey has a unique disease only within that kind, and another kind goes and messes with that monkey, then they have the ability to contract whatever that mankey has.

I don't know where Aids come from..I'm only going by the stories I've heard...But if the law said do not lie with a beast it is an abomination...maybe somebody knew huh?
And if that monkey hadn't been messed with, which by the way was unclean because it didn't meet the requirements of clean meats..then it may have never gotten started.
But because somebody decided to do something outside the "norm", then well, could be that what happened was what was trying to be avoided.
There are a lot of sexual diseases. And if they are between the two in contact alone. Then it stops there and goes no farther.
But if adultery, fornication, promiscuity, prostitution..whatever..occurs, then the chances of those diseases being spread like fire are increased.

Isn't this commonsense? Am I blowing it all out of proportion?

maybe it's just the way how I can see a snowball turning into a mountain.. Confused or disgusted

Hugs..Emperor.. Laughing

Lone
_________________
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

P1234567890 · Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 9:06 am Post subject:

FFT · Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 9:15 am Post subject:

lone-traveler · Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 9:43 am Post subject:

I believe that everything that is created has it's own set of hmm.."laws".
This is going to sound really stupid and simplistic but I'm simple so bear with me..

The ocean creatures have a certain..hmm..dna whatever...that they exist on. Animals, birds, man... they all have there own set of rules for the best existance they can attain.
It's when we start to combine this and that, that those things which are unique to it's kind become combined with another kind, and creates chaos..disease..sickness..

So the things which cause diseases are already evident in each of it's own kind, but what is a disease to mankind may not be a disease to say a pig or snail...

There wasn't disease in the world until mankind starting eating whatever it was they weren't supposed to be eating, or doing.

That's like going to a planet that is inhabited by many different species. And each species keeps to itself, except what by instinct they are given to eat or do. Now add man into the mix, who rises above all the other species and decides to mess up the equilibrium...

You know in the beginning God said you can eat all green things, herbs and fruit...
This may have been the best diet for mankind.
But then we are told meat is ok, but by being allowed to eat meat came rules and regulations as to which ones would cause the least damage.

And now we just go around eating and drinking and doing whatever we want...and apparently this isn't the best diet.
I can't even begin to name all the sicknesses and diseases and impediments that happen to a body by what we eat or do.

I think diseases came about through a primitive desire to be scientists..LOL..seriously..
Mixing and matching and combining, until we have made means of mass destruction to destroy ourselves. In all forms and fashions..food, weapons, pesticides, air pollution, noise pollution..you name it.

A disease doesn't become a disease until it's disturbed from wherever it was meant to be. Something wakes it up, something irritates it...otherwise it wouldn't be dis-eased.

sorry I cant be more eloquent in speech...It's all I have..LOL

Smile

_________________
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

sofyst · Tiger Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 830 Location: Tejas

I personally think homosexuality is natural, or instinctual. But that in no way condones the behavior. It is naturally to want to have sex, but that doesn't mean you should act upon these desires every chance you get...
_________________
simul justus et peccator

the Protestant pub

firegreen · Tadpole Joined: 03 Feb 2007 Posts: 16

homosexual acts i believe are natural for humans, if we dont we run the very real risk of over population, which we already face, man own adaptation to our growth.

P1234567890 · Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 3:59 pm Post subject:

rjustice7 · Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:34 am Post subject: Hmm...

Hey Firegreen,

I would like to know why you don’t believe the creation story. I see you said something about not believing the creation story because man’s partner was taken from himself. That somehow doesn’t convince me that the creation story is a fake. I’m sure there must be something else that would cause you to not believe in the creation story, because this reason just lacks…thought. Also it appears that your goal would be to disprove the Bible because you don’t want to believe that homosexuality is wrong, or that there is a price to pay for our sins. I feel like this has caused you to neglect common sense. Voltaire, a French philosopher, was of the same opinion; he didn’t buy that creation story either. But let’s look at biblical prophecy. Voltaire said the Bible would stop being printed within 100 years time. He did not believe the Bible was strong enough to continue, because it had faults in it. See the Bible prophesies in Jeremiah, and Isaiah that God would bring Israel back as a nation again. Voltaire didn’t believe this possible as they had been without a nation of their own for 1,700 years at that time. The Ammonites, Hittites, Perizites, and Amelekites never came back as nations. Well Voltaire died, and years later after World War II Israel was restored as a nation. I’m sure that was only a lucky guess. Also, if God didn’t tell mankind what they should and shouldn’t do, then would there be a choice to disobey it? I mean you have to lay down the lines. There’s God and His ways, which God makes clear. Then there’s the alternate. Those are the choices. If you wanted to follow God, but didn’t know what He wanted, then how would you do it? He did give a choice. If God wasn’t going to give mankind a choice, then the tree of the knowledge of good and evil never would have been created in the first place. Anyhow, I’d just like to know some of your logic or where you’re getting this from.

StElsewhere · Guest

Zathrus · Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 1:42 pm Post subject:

StElsewhere · Guest

[quote="firegreen"]ok if there is a god and he did create us like it says in that book that we read that is loosley translated from a dead language, then why create mans partner from himself. i personally dont believe a word of this creation story, sounds a little far fetched for me. why would an all powerful being give us free will then tell us we can and cant do certain things, and that if we do them we will burn in hellfire? the reason people think that homosexual acts are wrong is because of the years of brainwashing by the church, im mean thousands of years. when in actuality everyday in the animal kingdom, which we are a part of (fact), there are animals instictually acting homosexual, which according to christianity, is not instictual. kinda weird huh? fact of the matter here is from my expert point of view if there was a god, he/she/it wouldnt care about your sexual orientation.

Ever read:
Psa 14:1 [[To the chief Musician, [A Psalm] of David.]] The fool hath said in his heart, [There is] no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, [there is] none that doeth good.

Psa 53:1 [[To the chief Musician upon Mahalath, Maschil, [A Psalm] of David.]] The fool hath said in his heart, [There is] no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: [there is] none that doeth good.

It is sad you feel this way...Oh taste and see that the LORD is good...But... He doesn't want anyone who doesn't want Him ... so don't feel bad... do whatever it is you want to do...and don't give the True and Living God another thought...but... be also aware that the WOG says:
Every knee shall bow and every tongue shall confess that Jesus Christ is LORD

...either in love and expectancy or in fear and judgment...that choice... is up to you Cool