Same Law

Pneuma · Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 2:37 pm Post subject: Same Law

The law is a twofold work the bringing of judgment and of grace.

We read is 2 Corinthians that the ministration of death is to be done away with.
What! How can that which leads to Christ be done away with?

2 Corinthians 3:6-14
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life. 7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away: 8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious? 9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. 10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth. 11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.
12 Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: 13 And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished: 14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

Luke 10:25-27
25 And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? 26 He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? 27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.

Matthew 22:36-40
36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Mark 12:28-31
28 And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all? 29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. 31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

These commandment were known and read.

So then why does it say in another place it’s a new commandment?

Answer to this question is further down in the post.

John 13:34-35
34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. 35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

1 John 2:7-8
7 Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning. 8 Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.

2 John 5-6
5 And now I beseech thee, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that which we had from the beginning, that we love one another. 6 And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

Answer: Because the natural man ( old man ) does not understand spiritual things.

When the Spirit of God reveals the true meaning of the law to us , it becomes new to our understanding, but the truth was always held in the law, for the law is spiritual.

John explains this when he wrote “Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.”

Then he explains why the old commandment becomes new “because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.”

The commandments then have been written in our hearts.

It’s the same law, its just how we apprehend the law, for the old man it’s death, for the new man it’s the law of the Spirit of life in Christ.

When we are in Christ all things become new.

A new heaven and earth.

Romans 8:1-4

There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made us free from the law of sin and death.

I am in full agreement with this statement.

So then how does the law of the Spirit of life frees us from the law of sin and death?

We have to die to self before we are free from the law of sin and death.
Now we cannot die to self because we are weak though the flesh, or said another way, our fleshly natural life cannot die to itself.
Thus God sending His son in the likeness of sinful flesh ,and for sin ,condemned sin in the flesh.
For what purpose?
That the righteousness of the law might be FULFILLED in us.

This is done not of works but by faith in Jesus Christ.
We of our own selves cannot keep Gods laws, but Though faith in Christ we are able to fulfill Gods law.

Jesus Christ is our example 1Pe.2:21

Matthew 5:17-18
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Now as Jesus is our example and He fulfilled the law ,we must also fulfill the law or we do not live after our example.

Now let me make this as plain as I can so no one accuses me of trying to bring us again into bondage of the law.

It is though faith in Jesus Christ that the law can only be fulfilled, not by any works of the law we try to do. The fulfilling of Gods law is all done though faith.

The above scripture say Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Until the law though Christ is fulfilled in us by faith one jot or tittle shall in no wise pass from the law.

Galatians 2:15-21
15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. 17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid. 18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. 19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. 20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. 21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

This passage of scripture is speaking of trying to be justified by the works of the law, this we cannot do. Our justification come only though faith in Jesus Christ. For if righteousness cometh by the works ( for it is works of the law these scriptures are speaking of) of the law then Christ is dead in vain. Paul explains how it is though life in Christ that he liveth. Therefore it is Christ that liveth in us and not of ourselves that Gods law is fulfilled. For Jesus Christ fulfilled Gods law in His person and He will fulfill it in ours also.

This is explained further in

Romans 10:1-4
Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. 2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

The end of the law is the fulfillment of it for Jesus did not come to destroy the law but to fulfil it.

When the law is fulfilled in us though Jesus Christ the law has no more hold on us for we have become dead to it but alive onto Christ.

This is worth repeating here:

And it is by fulfilling the law that the law no longer has any power over us.

Romans 13:8-10
8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. 9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

We can see here that love is the fulfilling the law.

Matthew 22:36-40
36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

All Gods law hang on two principles: to love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, soul and mind and to love our neighbour as ourselves.

If God law is done away with then so is the commandment to love the Lord with all our hearts and our neighbour as ourselves for on these two commandments HANG all the law and the prophets.

Brother/sister if you can except it the commandments “thou shalt not” are not just commandments per say but they are also a commandment with the promise to us “ thou shalt not”.
Example: “thou shalt not” covet is a commandment telling us not to covet.
Now if we look at the promise side of it we see
“Thou shalt not” covet, meaning when we are in Christ we “will not covet.”

1 John 3:20-24
20 For if our heart condemn us, God is greater
than our heart, and knoweth all things. 21 Beloved, if our heart condemn us not, then have we confidence toward God. 22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.
23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. 24 And he that KEEPETH his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

If we are not keeping His commandments we are not dwelling in Him, but have again come under the law.
It is the fulfilling of the law that loosens us from the bondage of the letter of the law.

This is only done by faith in Jesus Christ who fulfills Gods law in us
.
If we are alive in Him how can we not but fulfill Gods law.

God bless

lone-traveler · Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 4:49 pm Post subject:

I'm thinking God made his laws unbreakable Pneuma, in that He wrote them in our very hearts and minds.
Not like we can take them and cast them on the ground and break them to pieces like Moses did with the first set he got.
These are indestructible. In that your very conscience makes you aware of them.

unless ofcourse you have your conscience seared with a hot iron.

Does one know in ones heart to commit adultery is sin?
If you believe God, then that very commandment which is written in stone is also written in your heart and mind.

Does one know that to covet is sin?

It's unbreakable unless 1.you don't have a heart or 2. you've lost your mind.....

God gave all mankind his ways and steps his expectations of men, his direction, his counsels, the way he judges things.
Not only to the Jews which was written in stone which they BROKE.
These same ones are unbreakable.

You can't get away with...well someone dropped em off a mountain and I couldn't read them.....
You can't get away with...well someone added or took away from them when we wasn't looking...unless you yourself add or subtract to them. Well then that's between you and God.
God says here they are read them. Here they are understand them. I gave you a heart and a mind to be able to discern the spirit of the written word.

that's how I understand it Pneuma.
God Bless
Lone
_________________
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

Harry3142 · Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 11:41 pm Post subject:

"So I say. live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law."

"The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God."

"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other." (Galatians 5:16-26,NIV)

This is 'The Christians' Code of Conduct'. It is based on the Holy Spirit's entering our lives as a direct result of our accepting the salvation that God has given to us. But it does not save us; instead it is and outward sign that we have already been saved:

"Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin."

"But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood. He did this to demonstrate his justice, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished - he did it to demonstrate his justice at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus." (Romans 3:19-26,NIV)

The righteousness which God requires of all who hope to stand before him, only God can bestow. We cannot buy it or earn it by our own actions, though some would have us believe that we can. We must set aside our pride, recognize that we are sinners who have been given a truly remarkable gift, and then accept it as such. Our salvation is totally to be creditted to God's actions, and not our own, either before or after our acceptance of his gift to us.
_________________
"Blessed are they whose transgressions are forgiven, whose sins are covered. Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will never count against him." (Romans 4:7-8,NIV)

Pneuma · Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 7:41 am Post subject: n/a

Hi Harry were you posting this in agreement with what I posted or as a oppisite view?

I ask because I agree with what you wrote, and said the same thing only in different words.

God bless