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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8335
Location: Victoria, Canada
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 Posted: Sat May 27, 2006 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Nobby wrote: | | P1234567890 wrote: | | I agree; in any case it's a really strange rule to have around... You have to have two men fighting, and one of them accidentally hurts a pregnant woman. What are the chances of that happening? |
Probably very good!  Maybe she was sleeping around with the other guy & the husband found out! Naturaly since they were fighting over her she would be right in the middle of it, so she got hit & lost here baby!! How's that does that make a believable story??
That in no way shape or form designates abortion!   |
I agree, but the punishment makes things clear. If the Bible says that someone who hits the mother and causes a miscarriage should not be put to death, then abortion is ok.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8335
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Sat May 27, 2006 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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| thunder wrote: |
99% of all abortions are convenience based, pre-birth murders.
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No, they really aren't. If a woman doesn't want the child because she wants a career or wants to stay in school, or something like that, that is NOT convenience!
And stop calling abortion murder! Our legal system doesn't call it murder; and the Bible doesn't call it murder. So why do you call it murder?
| thunder wrote: |
Just because there is a substantial dollar amount and labor intensive concerns attached to welcoming the unborn child to enter our world with parents and family predisposed to their own selfish misgivings is no legitimate reason to disqualify a human life to enter our society.
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You really think that people have abortions because they're lazy and selfish?!? One of the best reasons for having an abortion is if a woman doesn't feel that she can support the baby. What if she's in school and doesn't want to have to drop out?!? What if she has hopes and goals that she wants to achieve before being a mother?!? That's NOT selfishness!
And a fetus is NOT human life. Nowhere in the bible does it say that a fetus has a soul! Killing things that have no souls is perfectly acceptable! Killing a fetus is no worse than killing a chicken! Neither of them have souls, so neither case is murder!
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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thunder
Lion King
Joined: 13 Sep 2003
Posts: 1222
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| Posted: Sat May 27, 2006 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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With that kind of logic, everyone should have an abortion.
In fact, perhaps we can get a bill passed that requires all females to have at least one abortion every year until they are twenty then, one every other year until they are thirty.
That way, abortion doctors, nurses and counsellors can become more astute at managing the circumstances.
Brilliant ... just brilliant.
thunder
_________________
Submit to God in Christ |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8335
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Sat May 27, 2006 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| thunder wrote: | With that kind of logic, everyone should have an abortion.
In fact, perhaps we can get a bill passed that requires all females to have at least one abortion every year until they are twenty then, one every other year until they are thirty.
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How does this follow AT ALL from what I posted?
I simply said that abortions are morally acceptable, since there is nothing in our law nor in the Bible that condemns them.
How does that somehow equate to promoting that women should have abortions as often as possible?
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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Nobby
Board - Admin
Joined: 16 Sep 2002
Posts: 5303
Location: Missouri
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| Posted: Sat May 27, 2006 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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| P1234567890 wrote: | | One of the best reasons for having an abortion is if a woman doesn't feel that she can support the baby. |
Let the father support it ! If she knows who it is!
| Quote: | | What if she's in school and doesn't want to have to drop out?!? |
Then maybe she needs to keep her pants on! 
| Quote: | | What if she has hopes and goals that she wants to achieve before being a mother?!? That's NOT selfishness! |
Same as above! 
| Quote: | | And a fetus is NOT human life. Nowhere in the bible does it say that a fetus has a soul! |
Nowhere does it say it doesn't have a soul either!
| Quote: | | Killing things that have no souls is perfectly acceptable! |
Where did you read or hear that??
| Quote: | | Killing a fetus is no worse than killing a chicken! |
So now your comparing the little fetus to a chicken!!
I don't believe I'll be able to eat a drumstick again!! 
| Quote: | | Neither of them have souls, so neither case is murder! |
Prove It. Prove to me that the little fetus doesn't have a soul!
Don't prove to me that a chicken has a soul!!
Or I know I'll never be able to eat a drumstick again!!
_________________
Much Love Nobby
CVP Smilies
dictionary Bible |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8335
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Sat May 27, 2006 8:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Nobby wrote: |
Let the father support it ! If she knows who it is!
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What if the father is also poor? And furthermore, even if the father can and will support it, being pregnant is no walk in the park. What if she doesn't want to go through all of that pain and incontinence and throwing up and hormonal imbalances? Forget about raising a child; being pregnant alone is enough to mess up a career or an education...
I conjecture that if men had to give birth, there would be no pro-life movement.
| Nobby wrote: |
| Quote: | | What if she's in school and doesn't want to have to drop out?!? |
Then maybe she needs to keep her pants on!
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Unfortunately, this is not an option. Humans are animals with reproductive instincts that cannot be supressed.
| Nobby wrote: |
| Quote: | | And a fetus is NOT human life. Nowhere in the bible does it say that a fetus has a soul! |
Nowhere does it say it doesn't have a soul either!
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I agree. The Bible is totally ambiguous on the issue. So why are there so many Christians out there with INCREDIBLY STRONG pro-life beliefs? Does the Bible's ambiguity justify these strong beliefs? No!
| Nobby wrote: |
| Quote: | | Killing things that have no souls is perfectly acceptable! |
Where did you read or hear that??
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We've been eating animals for as long as we've been around. Nobody goes to hell for killing animals. We kill mosquitos all the time. People hunt wild game for sport. Chrisitan doctrine does not condemn anyone for doing any of these things. Christian doctrine says that if it doesn't have a soul, then it is ok to kill it. Killing is only murder when someone with a soul is killed.
| Nobby wrote: |
| Quote: | | Killing a fetus is no worse than killing a chicken! |
So now your comparing the little fetus to a chicken!!
I don't believe I'll be able to eat a drumstick again!!
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Ok, point well-taken. I take back the analogy, but not the point I was trying to make! 
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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Gabbylittleangel
House Cat
Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 173
Location: Florida
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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Using Exodus 21:22 To justify abortion?
Make sure that you have all of the conditions of that verse. First, you must have men striving; and hurt the woman...
Gabbylittleangel
FYI: Gabbylittleangel was born in 1957, and could have been aborted by even todays pro-life standards. Conceived in rape, and born with multiple birth defects. |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8335
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Gabbylittleangel wrote: | Using Exodus 21:22 To justify abortion?
Make sure that you have all of the conditions of that verse. First, you must have men striving; and hurt the woman...
Gabbylittleangel
FYI: Gabbylittleangel was born in 1957, and could have been aborted by even todays pro-life standards. Conceived in rape, and born with multiple birth defects. |
Today's pro-life standards are pretty much that any woman who wants an abortion can get one for any reason. Anyone can be aborted.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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FFT
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 6338
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Any woman that can pay for one, anyway. |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8335
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 7:26 pm Post subject: |
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| FFT wrote: | | Any woman that can pay for one, anyway. |
Oh yeah, I forgot that in the U.S. health care system the poor get shafted... I guess I was talking about Canada.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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FFT
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 6338
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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| The poor may get shafted but we don't have to wait months for emergency surgery |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8335
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 4:27 am Post subject: |
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| FFT wrote: | | The poor may get shafted but we don't have to wait months for emergency surgery |
I avoid that problem by just never needing emergency surgery.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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Ana
King of the Jungle
Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 1566
Location: BC
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| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 8:00 am Post subject: |
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| P1234567890 wrote: | | FFT wrote: | | The poor may get shafted but we don't have to wait months for emergency surgery |
I avoid that problem by just never needing emergency surgery. |
That's sound policy!
_________________
Truth doesn't care about theology, and theology doesn't care about truth.
Ana's Bananas |
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Gabbylittleangel
House Cat
Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 173
Location: Florida
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| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 5:03 am Post subject: |
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| P1234567890 wrote: |
And a fetus is NOT human life. |
 If it is not a life, why kill it?
Gabbylittleangel |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8335
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 5:16 am Post subject: |
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| Gabbylittleangel wrote: | | P1234567890 wrote: |
And a fetus is NOT human life. |
If it is not a life, why kill it?
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Because maybe there's a good reason to kill it.
Besides, nobody said that it is not a life. Just that it should not be considered a HUMAN life.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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