Catholic church warming up to condoms

FFT · Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 1:45 pm Post subject:

That's all well and good, l-t, but these things say nothing about the reliability of condoms.

lone-traveler · Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 2:32 pm Post subject:

what good is the reliability of the condom if you don't have the reliability in the ones actually using them??

thats like saying it's the gun that kills and not the one who wields it...

thanks for your reply FFT

peace
lone
_________________
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

P1234567890 · Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 5:15 pm Post subject:

Come on guys, this whole debate is silly. Condoms work pretty darned well both for preventing pregnancy and for preventing the transmission of disease.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous.

P1234567890 · Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 6:59 pm Post subject:

And incidentally, everyone here should understand the moral implications of telling people that condoms don't work. Someone might believe Roger and stop using condoms, and directly lead to suffering and death! It is highly irresponsible to make statements like this.

I suppose this is why for once RevJP and I were on the same side of an argument!
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous.

RevJP · Moderator Joined: 18 Apr 2003 Posts: 7005 Location: USA

Moral implications? What is more moral than abstinence?

FFT, your personal experiences aside; your statements are completely false, or do you not beleive the companies that actually produce the condoms, the wealth of medical research, and the volumes of personal testimony that states emphatically that condoms are NOT 100% effective if you use them properly?
_________________
JP's Mind - my blog

FFT · Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:22 pm Post subject:

Mostly, I don't trust people to be honest about their own mistakes. I also don't expect people to understand what "ethical behavior" is.

Condoms don't break on their own. Semen can't get through them if they are intact.

P1234567890 · Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 3:31 am Post subject:

lone-traveler · Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 4:34 am Post subject:

Roger wrote:

P1234567890 · Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:01 am Post subject:

Sorry; my mistake. I stand corrected. I should try to be less lazy and actually go back and read what people write rather than relying on my distracted memory!

In any case, Roger is still wrong, and condoms are much more than 85% effective.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous.

lone-traveler · Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:39 am Post subject:

Jdg 18:7 Then the five men departed, and came to Laish, and saw the people that [were] therein, how they dwelt careless, after the manner of the Zidonians, quiet and secure; and [there was] no magistrate in the land, that might put [them] to shame in [any] thing; and they [were] far from the Zidonians, and had no business with [any] man.

Zep 3:5 The just LORD [is] in the midst thereof; he will not do iniquity: every morning doth he bring his judgment to light, he faileth not; but the unjust knoweth no shame.

Phl 3:19 Whose end [is] destruction, whose God [is their] belly, and [whose] glory [is] in their shame, who mind earthly things.)
_________________
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

P1234567890 · Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:49 am Post subject:

I said sorry, and admitted my mistake! Would you like me to spell it out a little more?

Roger, I apologize for my mistake. I misread your post, and all of my comments about 'moral implications' were subsequently out of line. You are not going to cause suffering and death with this comment; I was wrong. I hope you accept this apology and I hope that you believe that it was an honest mistake.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous.

RevJP · Moderator Joined: 18 Apr 2003 Posts: 7005 Location: USA

Actually it was I who said 85% effective.