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theseldomscene
Banned
Joined: 17 Mar 2005
Posts: 7817
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 Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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| it's not impossible p38...with all the poor women fixed...no more crime as you say...only it is better...no more hunger or needless suffering...it would be the solution to so many problems...it would also end abortion and the pro lifers could all go home... it is the most sensible thing you could argue... |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8324
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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| theseldomscene wrote: | | it's not impossible p38...with all the poor women fixed...no more crime as you say...only it is better...no more hunger or needless suffering...it would be the solution to so many problems...it would also end abortion and the pro lifers could all go home... it is the most sensible thing you could argue... |
The forced sterilization of poor women is a heinous, evil idea. It would cause FAR more problems than it would solve.
Plus, you don't honestly believe that the pro-lifers would go home before ALL abortions, be they performed on poor women or not, be banned, do you?
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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theseldomscene
Banned
Joined: 17 Mar 2005
Posts: 7817
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| Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| probably not...they do seem to be a determined bunch don't they? |
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theseldomscene
Banned
Joined: 17 Mar 2005
Posts: 7817
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| Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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| on second thought your right...it would be far easier and cheaper...not to mention quicker, to force aall men below a certain income level to be fixed..what do you think?... |
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lone-traveler
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 6365
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 7:03 pm Post subject: |
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I went looking under abortion statistics nationwide and worldwide and I couldn't find where abortions were based on income...
Is there a site that says more poor women get abortions more so than women who are not poor?
I found statistics that say more single women rather than married do, but I can't find abortions based on income.
thanks
lone
_________________
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. |
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FFT
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 6337
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:35 pm Post subject: |
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Remember, abortions aren't cheap. They're a sizeable ... investment 
_________________
When Science was in its crib, Religion tried to strangle it. When Science was in its infancy, Religion tried to abuse it. Now that Science is grown up, Religion wants to be in its good graces.
Theology is philosophy/ethics for people who already know what conclusion they want to come to. |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8324
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 7:46 am Post subject: |
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| lone-traveler wrote: | I went looking under abortion statistics nationwide and worldwide and I couldn't find where abortions were based on income...
Is there a site that says more poor women get abortions more so than women who are not poor?
I found statistics that say more single women rather than married do, but I can't find abortions based on income.
thanks
lone |
There are a lot of stats here: http://www.abortionno.org/Resources/fastfacts.html .
| Quote: |
Who's having abortions (race)?
While white women obtain 60% of all abortions, their abortion rate is well below that of minority women. Black women are more than 3 times as likely as white women to have an abortion, and Hispanic women are roughly 2 times as likely.
Who's having abortions (income)?
Women with family incomes less than $15,000 obtain 28.7% of all abortions; Women with family incomes between $15,000 and $29,999 obtain 19.5%; Women with family incomes between $30,000 and $59,999 obtain 38.0%; Women with family incomes over $60,000 obtain 13.8%.
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These stats clearly show that richer women from affluent white backgrounds have far fewer abortions than their poorer counterparts.
However, note that this is not actually important. All we really care about is the 28.7% of women whose family income is less than $15,000. That's a huge number of babies being aborted that would otherwise be poor and desparate their whole lives, and be most at risk of becoming criminals.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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lone-traveler
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 6365
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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thankyou for the link P
lone
_________________
Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. |
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cballard
Grizzly Bear
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 731
Location: WV
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| Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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| I don't like labeling poor babies as worthless and rich babies as worthy. |
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RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 7005
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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Um.... I was looking at the stats you posted P and it said:
| Quote: | | Women with family incomes between $30,000 and $59,999 obtain 38.0% |
To which you concluded: These stats clearly show that richer women from affluent white backgrounds have far fewer abortions than their poorer counterparts.
How do you come to that conclusion based on the information you provided? Clearly the bulk of abortions are had by women in mid to high income brackets (38 + 13.8 = 51.8%) quite the opposite of your assertion, isn't it?
Take the bottom two income brackets: 48.2%. The facts you provided dispute your own claims.
Furthermore; your race statistics mean very little. The statistic for white women is a percentage per capita, then the 'stats' move away from a per capita ratio into a different measurement. This blending of statistics serves only to support a point which is unsupportable by the facts.
_________________
JP's Mind - my blog
Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8324
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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| cballard wrote: | | I don't like labeling poor babies as worthless and rich babies as worthy. |
As far as I can tell, nobody here is labeling poor babies as worthless and rich babies as worthy. If anything, I would argue that rich people end up being worse people than poor ones because their privileged background gives them a sense of entitlement, arrogance, and aggressiveness.
What I HAVE been saying is that unwanted babies that grow up in desperate circumstances are in a very high risk group for becoming criminals later in life, and I think that this is a true statement.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 8324
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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| RevJP wrote: | Um.... I was looking at the stats you posted P and it said:
| Quote: | | Women with family incomes between $30,000 and $59,999 obtain 38.0% |
To which you concluded: These stats clearly show that richer women from affluent white backgrounds have far fewer abortions than their poorer counterparts.
How do you come to that conclusion based on the information you provided? Clearly the bulk of abortions are had by women in mid to high income brackets (38 + 13.8 = 51.8%) quite the opposite of your assertion, isn't it?
Take the bottom two income brackets: 48.2%. The facts you provided dispute your own claims.
Furthermore; your race statistics mean very little. The statistic for white women is a percentage per capita, then the 'stats' move away from a per capita ratio into a different measurement. This blending of statistics serves only to support a point which is unsupportable by the facts. |
You can also look at it this way:
| Quote: | | Women with family incomes over $60,000 obtain 13.8% |
Which sounds to me like women from wealthier backgrounds have very few abortions.
In any case, none of this matters one bit. The only thing I really care about is that
| Quote: | | Women with family incomes less than $15,000 obtain 28.7% of all abortions |
That means that 28.7% of abortions are of babies that would grow up in poverty and would be much more likely to become criminals.
Before Roe v. Wade, most of these babies in the lowest group were NOT being aborted. After Roe v. Wade, they WERE being aborted. It is pretty clear that this would have had an impact on crime 20 years later.
That is my point.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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Roger459
Grizzly Bear
Joined: 25 Nov 2002
Posts: 709
Location: Pinellas Park, FL, USA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 5:10 pm Post subject: GOD REPLYS . . . |
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***(Exo 20:13) Thou shalt not MURDER. [kill]
There is in the Hebrew Language, that the OT was written in, 5-Words for the term - Kill. The one used here in the 10-Commandments, is the one used for == INNOCENT LIFE ! God knew Exactly what HE was speaking, and those that Heard = Knew IT TOO!
***(Genesis 4:9-10) And the LORD said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?
(Gen 4:10) And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's = = BLOOD = = crieth unto me from the ground.
***(Isaiah 59:1-to-4) Behold, the LORD'S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear:
(Isa 59:2) But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.
(Isa 59:3) For your hands are = = DELILED WITH BLOOD = = and your fingers with iniquity; your lips have spoken lies, your tongue hath muttered perverseness.
(Isa 59:4) None calleth for justice, nor any pleadeth for truth: they trust in vanity, and speak lies; they conceive mischief, and bring forth iniquity.
***(Jer 7:6) If ye oppress not the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow, and shed not = = INNOCENT BLOOD = = in this place, neither walk after other gods to your hurt:
(Jer 7:7) Then will I cause you to dwell in this place, in the land that I gave to your fathers, for ever and ever.
(Jer 7:8) Behold, ye trust in lying words, that cannot profit.
(Jer 7:9) Will ye steal, murder, and commit adultery, and swear falsely, and burn incense unto Baal, and walk after other gods whom ye know not;
(Jer 7:10) And come and stand before me in this house, which is called by my name, and say, We are delivered to do all these abominations?
(Jer 7:11) Is this house, which is called by my name, become a den of robbers in your eyes? Behold, even I have seen it, saith the LORD.
*** (Ezekiel 36:18) Wherefore I poured my fury upon them = = FOR THE BLOOD = = that they had shed upon the land, and for their idols wherewith they had = = POLLUTED IT:
Needless IF You will not only read these verses, but the many other, YOU WILL SEE = THAT GOD CANNOT ALLOW US TO GO ON LIKE THIS!
Thanks, RR |
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FFT
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 6337
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 5:16 pm Post subject: Re: GOD REPLYS . . . |
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| ROGER459 wrote: | | Needless IF You will not only read these verses, but the many other, YOU WILL SEE = THAT GOD CANNOT ALLOW US TO GO ON LIKE THIS! |
Funny how he's left us to our own devices then, isn't it?
_________________
When Science was in its crib, Religion tried to strangle it. When Science was in its infancy, Religion tried to abuse it. Now that Science is grown up, Religion wants to be in its good graces.
Theology is philosophy/ethics for people who already know what conclusion they want to come to. |
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RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 7005
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Before Roe v. Wade, most of these babies in the lowest group were NOT being aborted. After Roe v. Wade, they WERE being aborted. It is pretty clear that this would have had an impact on crime 20 years later. |
What evidence do you base this assertion on exactly?
Your statistics do not cover abortions prior to Roe vs. Wade so you have nothing to compare and thus nothing but your own opinion on which to make your assertions.
Make your claims based on facts and evidence. That is truly a more 'scientific' approach, is it not?
_________________
JP's Mind - my blog
Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
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