breakable and unbreakable

lone-traveler · Posted: Sat May 10, 2008 9:29 pm Post subject: breakable and unbreakable

something you wrote pondering:

45degreeN · Posted: Sun May 11, 2008 5:54 am Post subject:

Lone sometimes I wonder where you get ideas such as this

lone-traveler · Posted: Sun May 11, 2008 10:34 am Post subject:

hi 45,

lone-traveler · Posted: Sun May 11, 2008 3:12 pm Post subject:

what if there was no bible?

would good still be good and bad still be bad?
Or do we have to have the bible to tell us the difference?
How did Abraham keep all of God's commandments if he didn't have scripture to go by?

scripture wasn't written till Moses, so how did Abraham know?

hugs

Roster · Tadpole Joined: 09 May 2008 Posts: 26

I don't know how the human's conscience was in Abraham's day. Obviously he had a good one. I think there has always been spiritual people in the world since the beginning of time. But my question is how many were there. Were there just a select few, and all the others didn't have this conscience, or had the conscience not yet developed, or were there many spiritual people, ones with a conscience? I ask this because, I don't think ALL people need the Bible, or any book to be good (they are just references of how to be a good person). I believe that all positive books that speak of being a good person dwell within the conscience, or come from the conscience. I think of myself as having the angel and devil that we used to see on cartoons. The angel is God's Spirit, my conscience, and the ego is the selfish part that I have yet to fully put off since birth (not satan). When an infant becomes aware of their independence, they kick, scream, whine, etc. until they get what they want. They are considered to be egocentric. They care for only themselves and their needs at the moment of need or want. As we develop as humans, we slowly learn to put this self centered thought away because we are taught that it is not good. And if we really think about it ourselves, then we will realize it isn't good, because we wouldn't want to be treated that way.

As I have said before. I know many people that are not Christians, and are considered to be good. What is considered good and what is considered bad? I think too much or not enough of anything can be bad. If the brain gets too much oxygen, one will become dizzy, not enough they die. If one eats too much they become obese, not enough they die. If one bathes themselves too much, their skin becomes too dry, if not, they stink. Where is the fine line? I think everyone must find their own. 99% of the things that the NT speaks of as far as sin I can agree on. I think that if one pollutes or takes more than what one needs from the earth, that thats is a sin, and I can't remember off the top of my head if the Bible speaks of any of these things.

I personally don't believe one needs the Bible to be a good person. I've witnessed people at the Church I used to attend have family problems because one coverts to a diff. Church than what the family has been going to for years and breaks the tradition. When families break up over faith, to me thats bad. It is good that they have that much faith in God, but I don't think God would want us to have to split over His Word. We are missing out on good times we could be spending and learning with these people, but we can't, not because they are bad or evil (they are good hearted indeed), simply because they don't have the same faith.

I don't believe I ever needed Moses to get the 10 Commandments, they are in my heart, and the same for all the positive in the NT. I think these enlightened people in the Bible times were way beyond anybody else as far as their conscience being developed. To me, they were the psychologists of their times.

lone-traveler · Posted: Mon May 12, 2008 11:24 am Post subject:

Hi Roster,

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and [their] thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

Hbr 8:10 For this [is] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

hmm...the house of Israel and the Gentiles both share something in common. They have the laws of God already written in their hearts and minds.
Now if we already have recieved the promise of the new covenant why are we still walking in the Old covenant which had their law written in stone?
There is a law of stone which is laid upon those with stone hearts, who will not hear, who will not have their hearts circumcised and reveal the flesh heart of love and mercy within it.
There is a law of Spirit which is laid upon those who have hearts of flesh, who hear, and have had their hearts circumcised which reveal the love and mercy which was aleady there all along.

I believe the stone (covered) their hearts. That truly the flesh was always there but they hardened it.

And the scriptures are a "witness" to the truth of how man has a heart of flesh, how it became hard as stone, how some chose to walk according to the Spirit which God gave man to walk in, and some chose to walk after their own hearts of stone.
And so th scriptures are the proof of who we are, where we been, the pits we have fallen into, and the route of escape made known. It is the book of life..and how to rise up from the dead (living in darkness) and walk in the ways of the living (living in the light)..

So the scriptures are our history our present life and our future. And how we can change tomorrows history by changing our present ways to day.

They are the truth of how man fell and how God raised man back up. And now we are use those examples for our benefit so we don't repeat it all over again..

and yet, history repeats itself....
unless we can find a way to change it..

I have hope someday all things will be new, and we no longer will walk in the same paths which lead us into destruction over and over again.

hugs
lone

Roster · Tadpole Joined: 09 May 2008 Posts: 26

Lone, If you don't mind, I was wondering about what your opinion was on someone that practices buddhism or I guess I should say any religion besides Christianity, will they be saved or not? You don't have to answer, I was curious to see what you think, because you seem to look at things in a different way than other people do that I have talked to. I have gotten answers from other people, but they simply said no because I think it is more the way they have been raised, verses knowing the Bible really well or knowing if one is righteous even in another religion.

lone-traveler · Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 11:15 am Post subject:

Hi Roster,

was doing a quick study yesterday about the different kinds of animals God created and how he created them clean and unclean. In the days of Noah God chose from both clean and unclean animals to save alive to repopulate the earth. He didn't just choose sheep or doves, he chose goats and snakes and creeping things..
all kinds after their kind.

So when you ask me will God only save christians. that's like, will God only save the sheep and not the goats?
If this were the case then how would we ever learn the difference between doing good and doing bad?

So then..when God chose the animals himself he chose them male and female too. So there are those who wear the pants and those who wear the dress. And yet God saved them both the same.

Now the question is..how many kinds of animals did God save in the ark?

So when you ask me about religions or beliefs or enlightenment or science or psychology or medicine doctorate or whatever..these I see as all the different kinds God chose for himself.

Now there are certan animals God chose from each kind after it's own kind to repopulate the earth. And the bible says what ever God didn't choose perished.
Like, whatever God decided to call unrighteous or unworthy or unclean or evil..it drowned in the flood.

But, after that God promised that he would never destroy all life again. And we have his bow in the cloud as a witness to it. And so God keeps his word..literally..and his word is with him and his word is good..and his word is in us. So if he promised not to destroy all life again, we aught to keep that promise too and stop destroying each other amen?

and God saw everything he made and it was good.
But then they wasn't good and God destroyed them. and then he promised never to do it again.so now today..check this out..we are taught that God is going to again destroy all those things he promised he would never destroy again..so God must be a liar then.
or, maybe we just aren't seeing the whole picture..
and the whole picture being that God already saved everything from the foundation of the world. and when he saw it, it was good.
But when man came along they started calling God's good evil. Like..if you don't believe this way, then your evil and you will die.

That's like a fish saying to the cow if you don't learn to swim like me God is going to kill you.
Or like the dove saying to the pig..if you don't grow wings and fly God is going to kill you.
Do you see how rediculous this is? and yet we say, because your not a christian and think this way, or do it that way God is going to kill you.

So now we have Budhists and Christians and Judaism and Confusious..i mean I can't tell you how many kinds God has made for his own good pleasure amen?
Who am I to judge another's servant?
If God some how led the gentiles to call those who opposed Judaism Christians, and they accepted that name as their own, then who am I to argue. If God wants to give them another name and another name and another name..like God told Adam to name all the animals, man names himself names all the time, then that's alright with me too. Because whatever is not of God well, it won't last anyways. It just kind of gets blown away in the wind.

All it does is distinguish the difference between the cow and the bull, the dove from the crow, the whale from the dolphin..see what I'm saying?
But all creatures are good and they are God's.
And I think that's the most important lesson the Noah has to share with us.
That even though the entire world was evil. God chose both clean and unclean, male female, of ALL KINDS of animals.

And I read the bible backwards sometimes meaning that in the end it will all be the same as it was in the beginning, when God saw everything that He created and it was good.

That includes every tree every green thing, everything in the air, everything in the waters, and everything in the earth.
And the only true evil is when we percieve any of God's works as evil after he has already declared them good.

If God didn't create Budha he wouldn't exist. If God didn't create Jehovah he wouldn't exist, if God didn't create Jesus he wouldn't exist.. see all things come from God and go back to God because all things belong to him.
And another thing we do which is not good is to try to claim them as our own and change them into what we want them to be and not what God wants them to be.
So then, we play God..making ourselves to look like God, rather than just excepting the things he has already made.

I'm on a soap box today.. Rolling Eyes

ramblin on..
hugs Roster
lone