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JB
Lion King
Joined: 16 Feb 2008
Posts: 1048
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 Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 10:50 am Post subject: |
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Pete,
I know that this post is important. I was just looking for a reason to praise the Lord.
God Bless you my friend and Brother |
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Pete
Lion King
Joined: 31 May 2006
Posts: 1015
Location: Arlington Hts., Il. USA
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| Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 10:53 am Post subject: |
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| JB wrote: | Pete,
I know that this post is important. I was just looking for a reason to praise the Lord.
God Bless you my friend and Brother |
Back to ya, JB! Pete |
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JimD
Bear Cub
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 628
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| Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Pete said:
However, if all the facts be put together, Jesus was crucified on a Thursday at 9 A.M. (third hour); died at three in th aft (ninth hour), and from noon (sixth hour) there was darkness over the land. Jesus was taken down and entombed a little before sunset.
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Pete, if Jesus was crucified on Thursday, does this mean he ate Passover on Wednesday? If so, I assume the rest of the Jews did also. Do they still have their main Passover meal on Wednesday? Why does Passover start on Sunday-20th ? Why are we so far out of sink with the Jews, and the Eastern Orthodox Church? As you can see, I am still confused 
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Anyone can point out a scripture here and there and prove anything they want to believe, but good theology is understanding the message of the gospel as a whole. Sincerely, JimD |
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Yehushuan
King Kong
Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 2848
Location: Charismatic
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 9:11 am Post subject: |
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| JimD wrote: | if Jesus was crucified on Thursday, does this mean he ate Passover on Wednesday?
Yes, back then ~ 2000 years ago.
Do they still have their main Passover meal on Wednesday? |
No. The Jewish celebration is based upon the date of the month, like December 25th. The day changes, but the date remains the same. The Christian Church celebrates the ressurection on the first day of the week, a Sunday, apart from the date.
I'd like to offer you THIS LINK to the concerns over the Easter Controversy. (Just remember that Lent is a fast before Easter, and the early church considered the fast just as important as Easter itself.)
The Orthodox Church uses a different calendar to arrive at the specific Sunday.
Yehu
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There must be a God; Natural Selection would have gotten rid of you a long time ago. |
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Pete
Lion King
Joined: 31 May 2006
Posts: 1015
Location: Arlington Hts., Il. USA
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 10:17 am Post subject: |
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| JimD wrote: |
Why does Passover start on Sunday-20th ? Why are we so far out of sink with the Jews, and the Eastern Orthodox Church? As you can see, I am still confused :? |
Easter is annually observed on a Sunday - the first Sunday after the Spring equinox, and is based on the Solar calendar. "The Jewish calendar is LUNI-SOLAR, which is in contrast to the Gregorian, which is purely solar, and in which the months have completely lost their relation to the moon." Quote is from the "Comprehensive Hebrew Calendar" by Arthur Spier(page 1).
Passover can fall on different days of the week, and on different dates on our Gregorian calendar. In contrast to Trinitarianism, which venerates Sunday as special, the day of the week has no significance for Jews. |
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Yehushuan
King Kong
Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 2848
Location: Charismatic
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Pete wrote: | | Easter is annually observed on a Sunday - |
Interestingly enough, not always had it been.
| Pete wrote: | | In contrast to Trinitarianism, which venerates Sunday as special |
And yet the 7DAv are Trinitarian. How odd.
Yehu
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There must be a God; Natural Selection would have gotten rid of you a long time ago. |
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Pete
Lion King
Joined: 31 May 2006
Posts: 1015
Location: Arlington Hts., Il. USA
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 7:25 am Post subject: |
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A couple more reasons why Jesus could not have been crucified on a Friday:
Jesus died at the ninth hour of the day (3 p.m.), at exactly the same time as the sacrificial rituals in the temple were completed. Temple rituals were usually completed at this hour with one exception. If the day of preparation fell on a Friday, the rituals had to be over by noon to allow enough time for cleanup, so as not to be in danger of running out of time before sunset and the weekly Sabbath, when no work could be done.
Another point that militates against a Friday crucifixion is that the priests went to see Pilate the next day to establish and set up a guard at the tomb. If that day was the weekly Sabbath, they would have been doing work, causing others to do work, and carrying on business with “gentile dogs” – a serious violation of the weekly Sabbath. |
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45degreeN
King Kong
Joined: 02 Aug 2005
Posts: 2672
Location: Salem Oregon
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 7:48 am Post subject: |
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Well the first Sunday after Passover is the Feast of First Fruits and the resurrection seems to fulfill the meaning of this feast. So a Saturday evening (beginning of Sunday) resurrection would be called for.
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My boss is a Jewish carpenter.
Read the
www.Christian-Thinktank.com |
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Yehushuan
King Kong
Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 2848
Location: Charismatic
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:30 am Post subject: |
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| 45degreeN wrote: | | Well the first Sunday after Passover is the Feast of First Fruits |
Far be it from me to consider myself an expert on such matters. So.... could I kindly request a citation to support this?
Yehu
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45degreeN
King Kong
Joined: 02 Aug 2005
Posts: 2672
Location: Salem Oregon
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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What, the connection between first fruits and resurrection?
1Corinthinians 15:22
| Quote: | | 20But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27For he "has put everything under his feet." Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all. |
Sounds to me like a very conclusive citation.
Or are you questioning the sequence of events and that First fruits is the next first day of the week after Passover?
Leviticus 23 | Quote: | The Passover and Unleavened Bread
4 " 'These are the LORD's appointed feasts, the sacred assemblies you are to proclaim at their appointed times: 5 The LORD's Passover begins at twilight on the fourteenth day of the first month. 6 On the fifteenth day of that month the LORD's Feast of Unleavened Bread begins; for seven days you must eat bread made without yeast. 7 On the first day hold a sacred assembly and do no regular work. 8 For seven days present an offering made to the LORD by fire. And on the seventh day hold a sacred assembly and do no regular work.' "
Firstfruits
9 The LORD said to Moses, 10 "Speak to the Israelites and say to them: 'When you enter the land I am going to give you and you reap its harvest, bring to the priest a sheaf of the first grain you harvest. 11 He is to wave the sheaf before the LORD so it will be accepted on your behalf; the priest is to wave it on the day after the Sabbath. 12 On the day you wave the sheaf, you must sacrifice as a burnt offering to the LORD a lamb a year old without defect, 13 together with its grain offering of two-tenths of an ephah [a] of fine flour mixed with oil—an offering made to the LORD by fire, a pleasing aroma—and its drink offering of a quarter of a hin [b] of wine. 14 You must not eat any bread, or roasted or new grain, until the very day you bring this offering to your God. This is to be a lasting ordinance for the generations to come, wherever you live.
In practice this took place on Sunday after Passover. |
_________________
My boss is a Jewish carpenter.
Read the
www.Christian-Thinktank.com |
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Yehushuan
King Kong
Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 2848
Location: Charismatic
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 4:36 pm Post subject: |
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| 45degreeN wrote: | | In practice this took place on Sunday after Passover. |
Says who? That’s the citation I’m looking for
| Leviticus wrote: | | and you reap its harvest |
Need I state the obvious that a harvest is in fall? Even were this to be a short seasoned crop, there would still be no harvest fruit available at spring. Nothing had yet been planted.
(Calling farmer John, Oh farmer John? …)
Yehu
_________________
There must be a God; Natural Selection would have gotten rid of you a long time ago. |
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JimD
Bear Cub
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 628
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| Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 4:59 am Post subject: |
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If Jesus ate passover on Wednesday evening after 6PM, that would be Thursday to the Jews? So he actually ate passover, and died on the same day?
_________________
Anyone can point out a scripture here and there and prove anything they want to believe, but good theology is understanding the message of the gospel as a whole. Sincerely, JimD |
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Pete
Lion King
Joined: 31 May 2006
Posts: 1015
Location: Arlington Hts., Il. USA
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| Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 1:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Yehushuan wrote: |
| Leviticus wrote: | | and you reap its harvest |
Need I state the obvious that a harvest is in fall? Even were this to be a short seasoned crop, there would still be no harvest fruit available at spring. Nothing had yet been planted.
(Calling farmer John, Oh farmer John? …)
Yehu |
The growing season in Israel is not like that of the U.S. or Europe. They have a much longer season, capable of two crops, spring and fall.
I think barley was harvested about Passover time, wheat around Pentecost , and then a crop around the fall holy days. |
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Yehushuan
King Kong
Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 2848
Location: Charismatic
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| Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 8:50 am Post subject: |
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| JimD wrote: | | If Jesus ate passover on Wednesday evening after 6PM, that would be Thursday to the Jews? So he actually ate passover, and died on the same day? |
EXACTLY.
Jesus did die on the Passover, but the nightime portion comes first.
The Gentile, though, would automatically think this to be two different days. The Roman would know Saturday was “the Sabbath” and that Friday was “the preparation” and since reading that Jesus’ body was taken down on “the preparation,” a Good Friday celebration ensued. Confuses Christians even today.
Look how the Roman Church severed Easter from the Jew-feast of Passover, out of their hatred of the Jews.
Yehu
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There must be a God; Natural Selection would have gotten rid of you a long time ago. |
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Yehushuan
King Kong
Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 2848
Location: Charismatic
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| Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 9:15 am Post subject: |
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Folks, THIS is an example of a REAL CITATION -
| The Israeli Tourist Board (link) wrote: | Shavuot, the Holiday of Weeks, is one of the three pilgrimage holidays, along with Pesach and Sukkot. These are the holidays on which the whole Jewish people would come to Jerusalem in ancient times, when the Holy Temple was there, and would offer animal and grain sacrifices.
Shavuot is observed at the end of the counting of the Omer: the counting of seven weeks (actually 50 days) from the first day of Pesach. At the beginning of the counting, Jews would bring an Omer (Biblical measure) of grain from the first barley harvest to the Holy Temple, and at the end would bring an Omer of grain from the first wheat harvest. The seven weeks in the counting of the Omer are what give the holiday its name.
A fundamentally agricultural holiday, Shavuot is also called the Harvest Holiday and the First Fruits (Bikkurim) Holiday, commemorating the custom of bringing offerings to the Holy Temple from the first fruits of the harvest and the first animals born to the flocks. This agricultural aspect of the holiday was retained even after the destruction of the Holy Temple: among the symbols of the holiday are the seven species with which the Land of Israel is blessed - wheat, barley, grapes, figs, pomegranates, olives and dates. {emphasis added} |
And as one can read, the First Fruits Holiday is observed 50 days AFTER Pesach.
It would seem that there had been a first fruit festival for EVERY grain that was harvested, but over time these seven distilled into two – barley and wheat, with the barley offering corresponding to Pesach only because the people were already in the city; and with seven trips a year, who could get anything done?
Thank you kindly for trying.
Yehu
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There must be a God; Natural Selection would have gotten rid of you a long time ago. |
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