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RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 6840
Location: USA
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 Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 6:32 am Post subject: |
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| lone wrote: | If I was to find a particular poster annoying, and I flagged every post by that one poster..daily. And I felt that the bulk of their posts had no bearing on the topic of discussion,
would I be considered the "bulk" of the membership? |
No, you wouldn't be, and this wasn't the case, at all.
| Quote: | | My biggest fear with this particular thread is that a lot of friends are going to be asked to leave because they are sticking up for people who they felt did not deserve to be banned. |
I'm curious as to why you would write this. It has been pointed out repeatedly that members are not banned capriciously, nor for expressing a difference of opinion. It is a truth that his board is designed as a place where we welcome differences of opinion and it is readily demonstrated throughout this board that the Admin and the moderators regularly support and enforce this attitude.
Heck, even when members disagree with decisions or actions of the moderating staff they are allowed to freely express their opinions on the subject. When the expression of those opinions turns to personal attacks, stating of lies, or continued promotion of ideas that are simply untrue, the moderators and admin do not 'ban' the member.
I will not rehash the decision concerning atoz, tss, and wilbur here, for they have been explained clearly and repeatedly already in this thread.
We have over 4000 registered members, an average of 30 or more visit the board everyday, more visit and read but do not post. Our job, is to make the best decisions we can for the contentment of ALL of these people, and as Spock said: "The needs of the many, outweigh the needs of the few, or the one." |
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eleven
Lion King
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1396
Location: Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 8:52 am Post subject: |
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| RevJP wrote: |
I will not rehash the decision concerning atoz, tss, and wilbur here, for they have been explained clearly and repeatedly already in this thread.
We have over 4000 registered members, an average of 30 or more visit the board everyday, more visit and read but do not post. Our job, is to make the best decisions we can for the contentment of ALL of these people, and as Spock said: "The needs of the many, outweigh the needs of the few, or the one." |
4000 members, who Nobby has already said are mostly spammers.
And PRAISE GOD, I follow Jesus, NOT Mr. Spock 
Luke 15: 3-7
3Then Jesus told them this parable: 4"Suppose one of you has a hundred sheep and loses one of them. Does he not leave the ninety-nine in the open country and go after the lost sheep until he finds it? 5And when he finds it, he joyfully puts it on his shoulders 6and goes home. Then he calls his friends and neighbors together and says, 'Rejoice with me; I have found my lost sheep.' 7I tell you that in the same way there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent. |
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luvnlife
Lion King
Joined: 22 Feb 2007
Posts: 1132
Location: US
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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Eleven said:
| Quote: | Luke 15: 3-7
3Then Jesus told them this parable: 4"Suppose one of you has a hundred sheep and loses one of them. Does he not leave the ninety-nine in the open country and go after the lost sheep until he finds it? 5And when he finds it, he joyfully puts it on his shoulders 6and goes home. Then he calls his friends and neighbors together and says, 'Rejoice with me; I have found my lost sheep.' 7I tell you that in the same way there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent. |
My understanding is that the Moderators do give people the chance to return if they express a willingness to follow board rules and treat other members on the board as they would like to be treated.
Why is asking people to simply respect board rules and more importantly, respect each other such a big issue? Shouldn't that just be the norm?
Luv |
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PrysdieHeer!
Big Pit Bull
Joined: 30 Dec 2007
Posts: 392
Location: South Africa; Gardens of Pretoria
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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I would like to inform you that Atoz does not know why he was banned!
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Prys die Heer! |
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lone-traveler
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 6342
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Luv,
| Quote: | My understanding is that the Moderators do give people the chance to return if they express a willingness to follow board rules and treat other members on the board as they would like to be treated.
Why is asking people to simply respect board rules and more importantly, respect each other such a big issue? Shouldn't that just be the norm?
Luv |
I wish it was a perfect world too..but it's not huh?
I for one understand how difficult it is to be a mod. I couldn't cut the mustard so I handed the baton back to those who are more capable of wielding them then I.
Also, I can't see behind the lines. I don't have xray vision so I don't know what may or may not have transpired between managment and the members. All I do know is that I don't understand the rules or how they were broken which led to their removal.
In one post I read that posts were being flagged because they simply annoyed some people. There's lots of posts that annoy me too but I don't flag them, I just don't read them. And almost every thread in every catagory has been derailed at one point or another...again I'm a perfect example of a thread derailer. Not intentionally, but sometimes the wind just blows that way.
| Quote: | I wrote:
My biggest fear with this particular thread is that a lot of friends are going to be asked to leave because they are sticking up for people who they felt did not deserve to be banned.
Rev wrote:
I'm curious as to why you would write this. |
Because I think the reason why Wilber was banned is because he kept defending another poster who had been previously banned. And it was a sore spot among other particular members.
And I really don't mean to bring this into the issue but I believe it's the main theme running behind it all..
I know that there are certain "topics" that really annoy people. And it appears to me that those who share this particular "doctrine/topic" always manage to get on the hit list somehow.
And that is how it appears to me. Whether it is the main cause or just a part of it, well, I don't know. And whether it's something that is just imaginery in my mind or true, again I don't know.
| Quote: | | It has been pointed out repeatedly that members are not banned capriciously, nor for expressing a difference of opinion. |
I know it's been pointed out Rev, and I know for the most part this is true. But sometimes it seems as if the scales are tilted in a certain way, and if certain members don't agree with other members they have ways of hmm..sabotaging them.
For instance..If you don't like a particular member or topic or style that another member posts..then why instigate them into "long reply's" by asking them questions if they know that they can use those "long replies" against the one responding?
If I did not want to talk to member x and have a reply be about topic y knowing that it will generate an answer in the form of z, then why ask in the first place?
unless I knew that that could be used against the one I don't agree with in the first place..
Here, I'm confused:
| Quote: | | Heck, even when members disagree with decisions or actions of the moderating staff they are allowed to freely express their opinions on the subject. When the expression of those opinions turns to personal attacks, stating of lies, or continued promotion of ideas that are simply untrue, the moderators and admin do not 'ban' the member. |
personal attacks, stating of lies..what do you mean by continued promotion of ideas that are simply untrue?
untrue to whom?
and yet these are "not" banned..that's what I don't understand..I would think these would be at the top of the list..
| Quote: | | I will not rehash the decision concerning atoz, tss, and wilbur here, for they have been explained clearly and repeatedly already in this thread. |
Ok Rev, I may just be missing the explanation somehow.
I'm not trying to generate hard feelings here. I'm just trying to understand why I come in one day and a couple of my friends are gone and I can't figure out why?
What did they do wrong that I haven't done myself on occasion? And why should they be banned for speaking their opinions which as stated above are welcome..
I'm just a member here. By choice. And over the last few years I've come to know and love so many of you on here ..actually all of you, even if I don't agree with you.
| Quote: | | Our job, is to make the best decisions we can for the contentment of ALL of these people, and as Spock said: "The needs of the many, outweigh the needs of the few, or the one." |
I know, and you guys have a hard job too..and what you all do is very much appreciated. And if the "majority" asked for the removal of some members because they were disruptive or continually on the attack, then I understand.
Could be I'm just one of the few or the one here that feels slighted by this situation.
They say ignorance is bliss..but I tell you, sometimes it can be hell.
anywhooo..
I will speak no more on this matter, I've said all I have to say. I just wanted to share with you "my family", how I feel about the situation.
As a member of this "family" I felt it necessary to give my heart felt opinion..
Whether it is recieved with love as I have written in love, that is up to those who read it and take away with it what they will.
what's done is done..
God Bless
Lone |
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RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 6840
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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I really don't what more there is to say on this subject, the entire moderating staff has stressed repeatedly that we go to great pains to allow members the freedom to express themselves as long as they do not willfully violate the rules of the board.
Apparently there are, and will be, some who choose to view the assurances of the moderating staff of our sincere and strenuous efforts to be fair, as lies. I can do nothing to change that.
As for Atoz; Nobby has explained that the board owner made the decision regarding his membership, and that we had no knowledge of it, or say in the matter. I for one feel that if the owner of this free discussion board feels it necessary to make a decision, then that is all there is to it - nothing more needs to be discussed. |
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lone-traveler
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 6342
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | As for Atoz; Nobby has explained that the board owner made the decision regarding his membership, and that we had no knowledge of it, or say in the matter. I for one feel that if the owner of this free discussion board feels it necessary to make a decision, then that is all there is to it - nothing more needs to be discussed. |
Sorry Rev,
I agree with you totally..In the bold..I didn't know..
thankyou for helping me to understand better.
hugs
lone |
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RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 6840
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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It's not a problem Lone.
I understand that some people do not agree with decisions that have been made, or may be made in the future. I understand that some members will miss other members if they are no longer participants of the board. I, and the entire moderating/administrative staff, understands this and sympathizes with it.
We too have those same feelings, and have made decisions as a group regarding members whom we really did not want to see go. However, we did what we sincerely felt was the best for the continuing health of our community here.
What we do not understand (at least I don't) is why some members choose to believe the words of disgruntled ex-members over those of the moderating staff. Nor do I understand why some members seem intent on continuing to state, or insinuate, things that have no basis in fact, or even a remote indication that they may be true.
I do not like to be viewed, or accused of being unfair, capricious, a liar, or anything else of the sort. However, I can say with some degree of confidence that I can absolutely live with it, for ultimately I understand the type of person I am and the way I present myself. I am usually frank, and some may say, caustic. But I am honest.
What I cannot accept, what I will not accept, are assaults and insults upon my fellow staff members who have never done anything to anyone on these boards to give cause to such actions.
Nobby is above all a kind-hearted, generous, and caring individual. Mojo is no less, and an absolute sweetheart (and this coming from a member who has had more than a few tiffs with that lovely lady). Pastor2002 is new to the staff but has never given anyone cause to doubt his word, or take a dislike to.
What it boils down to is that I care a little (but not too much) about what people think of me. but our Beloved Admin, Nobby, Mojo, and Pastor2002 deserve nothing but everyone's utmost respect and gratitude for the people they are the job they do here to keep this board running and to keep it as a pleasant community for everyone. Anything less than that is, in my opinion, despicable. |
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luvnlife
Lion King
Joined: 22 Feb 2007
Posts: 1132
Location: US
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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I have only ever reported one person and that person had written hateful threatening things to me in the form of PM's and had also written some mean-spirited posts.
I cannot say that I completely understand Atoz being booted. Yes, he wrote much and wrote in a silly sing-song prose that drove some crazy. I admit I skipped over a lot of his posts because some of them did not make sense to me and/or were just too long. I cannot say that Atoz was the only person whose posts I skipped over, though. There have been others whose posts were too long or off-topic or too self-aggrandizing for my taste. I will be honest though and tell you that when Atoz was able to make a point in a straight-forward manner, he really knew how to drive a point home.
Did people complain too much? I don't know. I think in Atoz's case maybe they did because I don't recall him saying anything nasty or harmful to anyone, I think his style simply annoyed some people. I understand that his thousands of long posts probably did take up a lot of space on this forum and maybe Admin was looking at that too. If that's the case, I wonder if Admin has considered archiving some of the ancient posts from posters who are no longer even around to make room for the current forum family.
Luv  |
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PrysdieHeer!
Big Pit Bull
Joined: 30 Dec 2007
Posts: 392
Location: South Africa; Gardens of Pretoria
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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I personally enjoyed Atoz`s Poetry, this is how the Bible talks, in some areas like Job Psalms. However Atoz did not get any warnings, according to him.
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Prys die Heer! |
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PrysdieHeer!
Big Pit Bull
Joined: 30 Dec 2007
Posts: 392
Location: South Africa; Gardens of Pretoria
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| Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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Have atoz`s ban been removed?
Apoc`s?
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Prys die Heer! |
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eleven
Lion King
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1396
Location: Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 4:23 am Post subject: |
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Just about all of the previous posts bring up the points people have been asking over and over again, and still no answer other than "that's the way it was decided".
Ok, let me try to ask the same question in another way-
If people red flag a poster over and over again, is that grounds enough for that person to be removed? atoz may have been long in his responses, but only because his theology/philosophy is a little difficult to understand, so he tries to explain it. He didn't do it to be difficult, and he certainly wasn't disrespectful.
And yes, BTW, atoz still has not been given a notice of being banned.  |
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RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 6840
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 7:08 am Post subject: |
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What is it about the written language that people continue to ignore it or fail to understand it?
There needs to be no more discussion regarding atoz as that decision was made by the owner of the board and nothing anyone adds, or thinks they should add is relevant. I am sure the Beloved Admin made the decision he thought was best and is more than capable to review, or not review, that decision as he sees fit. I cannot speak for him but if it were me, the constant pestering would do nothing to sway me one way or the other. |
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eleven
Lion King
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1396
Location: Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| RevJP wrote: | What is it about the written language that people continue to ignore it or fail to understand it?
There needs to be no more discussion regarding atoz as that decision was made by the owner of the board and nothing anyone adds, or thinks they should add is relevant. I am sure the Beloved Admin made the decision he thought was best and is more than capable to review, or not review, that decision as he sees fit. I cannot speak for him but if it were me, the constant pestering would do nothing to sway me one way or the other. |
What is it about the art of conversation that YOU fail to understand? Nobody is talking about the famous decision on atoz itself. We are all just having a conversation about how it came about so that we can all understand it better. The only way to do that is to talk about it, and that's all this is - discussion. |
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Nobby
Board - Admin
Joined: 16 Sep 2002
Posts: 5046
Location: Missouri
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 10:20 am Post subject: |
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| eleven wrote: | | If people red flag a poster over and over again, is that grounds enough for that person to be removed? |
Just depends on the reason, yes it could be.
One thing I wanted to point out is if you continualy Red Flag the same poster over & over then I begin to wonder who is at fault!
If I get a lot of read flags from a lot of members complaining about the same member. Thats not good!
| eleven wrote: | | atoz may have been long in his responses, but only because his theology/philosophy is a little difficult to understand, so he tries to explain it. He didn't do it to be difficult, and he certainly wasn't disrespectful. |
No matter what you think of me! Think what you like!
I cared very much for Atoz. I saw it coming & I warned him. I wish now I had been more harsh! maybe he would have listened to me! But things didn't change they didn't even slow down. I wrote him another PM with more serious note, I told him this was the second warning, there wouldn't be another! There were no bad feelings between us! Atoz seemed to be really trying to do do better. Next thing I new I new he was ban.
Seems one of our members went over my head with an e-mail. 
Atoz & Wilber are both welcome to re-join if they want abide by the rules!  |
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