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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3035
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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 Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 4:46 pm Post subject: And the Answer is ? |
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Matthew 24:37 But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
These Bible verses answers the questions:
#1.) That God's "Investigative Judgment Day" must occur ...BEFORE.....Jesus Christ can come again, the 2nd time.
#2.) Also, it answers the Secret Rapture theory.....that there cannot be any such thing as a 7 year Tribulation peroid ...AFTER....Jesus Christ gathers His church, to take them back to heaven with Him.
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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eleven
Lion King
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1396
Location: Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 9:42 pm Post subject: Re: And the Answer is ? |
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| Silver Surfer wrote: | Matthew 24:37 But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
These Bible verses answers the questions:
#1.) That God's "Investigative Judgment Day" must occur ...BEFORE.....Jesus Christ can come again, the 2nd time.
#2.) Also, it answers the Secret Rapture theory.....that there cannot be any such thing as a 7 year Tribulation peroid ...AFTER....Jesus Christ gathers His church, to take them back to heaven with Him. |
May I ask, why does it matter? |
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Maverick1337
Goldfish
Joined: 18 Nov 2007
Posts: 64
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2008 11:45 pm Post subject: Re: And the Answer is ? |
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| eleven wrote: | | Silver Surfer wrote: | Matthew 24:37 But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. |
May I ask, why does it matter? |
Because God said it, so it obviously means something. 
_________________
Romans 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place
unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith
the Lord.
12:20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give
him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head. |
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eleven
Lion King
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1396
Location: Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 5:57 am Post subject: Re: And the Answer is ? |
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| Maverick1337 wrote: | | eleven wrote: | | Silver Surfer wrote: | Matthew 24:37 But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. |
May I ask, why does it matter? |
Because God said it, so it obviously means something. |
No, I meant why does it matter when or how it happens. |
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james
Grizzly Bear
Joined: 18 Sep 2007
Posts: 753
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| Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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These Bible verses answers the questions:
#1.) That God's "Investigative Judgment Day" must occur ...BEFORE.....Jesus Christ can come again, the 2nd time.
#2.) Also, it answers the Secret Rapture theory.....that there cannot be any such thing as a 7 year Tribulation peroid ...AFTER....Jesus Christ gathers His church, to take them back to heaven with Him.
That is only your opinion, thank you for sharing. But Scripture interprets scripture. |
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Maverick1337
Goldfish
Joined: 18 Nov 2007
Posts: 64
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| Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 5:22 am Post subject: |
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What James said is a bit harsh in my opinion (but thats Ok too ), but I totally agree, I know we're supposed to study scripture but I think doctrine thats brought about by interpretations of theologists and normal man causes A LOT of seperation amongst those who love the same God and Jesus.(This does not include the doctrine in the Bible just for clarification - duh  ) ) Hence me not selecting a denomination tag and just say "I'm a Christian. A man of Christ"
_________________
Romans 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place
unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith
the Lord.
12:20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give
him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head. |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3035
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 9:03 am Post subject: |
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| james wrote: | These Bible verses answers the questions:
#1.) That God's "Investigative Judgment Day" must occur ...BEFORE.....Jesus Christ can come again, the 2nd time.
#2.) Also, it answers the Secret Rapture theory.....that there cannot be any such thing as a 7 year Tribulation peroid ...AFTER....Jesus Christ gathers His church, to take them back to heaven with Him.
That is only your opinion, thank you for sharing. But Scripture interprets scripture. |
No...that is not my opinion, that is Biblical FACT !
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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galen
Ferret
Joined: 22 May 2005
Posts: 115
Location: Maine
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| Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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"1 Thess 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent [precede] them which are asleep.
:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words."
Our Lord Christ will descend from heaven, the angel host will sound, the dead will begin to rise [their first waking moment since they fell asleep] as they come up above the soil and reach the living, the living believers will raise with them, together we will raise into the heavens to meet the Lord. |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3035
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 4:09 am Post subject: |
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| galen wrote: | "1 Thess 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent [precede] them which are asleep.
:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words."
Our Lord Christ will descend from heaven, the angel host will sound, the dead will begin to rise [their first waking moment since they fell asleep] as they come up above the soil and reach the living, the living believers will raise with them, together we will raise into the heavens to meet the Lord. |
And careful consideration shows that if all the righteous are taken to heaven (both dead and alive) and the wicked are all destoyed at Christ's return....then there is no one left on earth alive for any 7 year tribulation to occur.
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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galen
Ferret
Joined: 22 May 2005
Posts: 115
Location: Maine
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| Posted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 4:23 am Post subject: |
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| Silver Surfer wrote: | | galen wrote: | "1 Thess 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent [precede] them which are asleep.
:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words."
Our Lord Christ will descend from heaven, the angel host will sound, the dead will begin to rise [their first waking moment since they fell asleep] as they come up above the soil and reach the living, the living believers will raise with them, together we will raise into the heavens to meet the Lord. |
And careful consideration shows that if all the righteous are taken to heaven (both dead and alive) and the wicked are all destoyed at Christ's return....then there is no one left on earth alive for any 7 year tribulation to occur. |
Perhaps I missed that part.
Where in 1 Thess 4:13-18 did it say that the wicked will all be destroyed at that moment? |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3035
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 7:18 am Post subject: |
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| galen wrote: | | Silver Surfer wrote: | | galen wrote: | "1 Thess 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent [precede] them which are asleep.
:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words."
Our Lord Christ will descend from heaven, the angel host will sound, the dead will begin to rise [their first waking moment since they fell asleep] as they come up above the soil and reach the living, the living believers will raise with them, together we will raise into the heavens to meet the Lord. |
And careful consideration shows that if all the righteous are taken to heaven (both dead and alive) and the wicked are all destoyed at Christ's return....then there is no one left on earth alive for any 7 year tribulation to occur. |
Perhaps I missed that part.
Where in 1 Thess 4:13-18 did it say that the wicked will all be destroyed at that moment? |
Actually it is found in 2 Thess.
2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and [by] our gathering together unto him,
2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for [that day shall not come], except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
2:5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth [will let], until he be taken out of the way.
2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
Which is what Matthew 24:37 says also.......
24:37 But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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galen
Ferret
Joined: 22 May 2005
Posts: 115
Location: Maine
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| Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 9:23 am Post subject: |
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1 Thess 4:13-18 gives a clear description of events to happen at one moment of time. The Lord will come for us, to snatch us away from the adversary's power, and we shall then leave.
It says nothing about anyone being destroyed. Only about Christ's followers being rescued.
2 Thess 2:1-8 Also tells us that at some at some point the Lord shall reveal the wicked, and shall destroy the wicked during his coming.
Are these both happening at the same time? It does not say.
We certainly do know that at some time, there will be a big battle during a coming of The Lord. However from the description of that battle the lead-in does sound entirely different from the lead-in of the first coming. |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3035
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 9:39 am Post subject: |
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| galen wrote: | 1 Thess 4:13-18 gives a clear description of events to happen at one moment of time. The Lord will come for us, to snatch us away from the adversary's power, and we shall then leave.
It says nothing about anyone being destroyed. Only about Christ's followers being rescued. |
True, it says nothing about what happens to all the other people left behind, I agree.
SO, what happens to all the other people Christ does not take with Him, at His 2nd coming ?
| Quote: |
2 Thess 2:1-8 Also tells us that at some at some point the Lord shall reveal the wicked, and shall destroy the wicked during his coming.
Are these both happening at the same time? It does not say. |
This a prime example of why people need to study any subject out, completely.
By that I mean, every Bible verse relating to a certain subject in the WHOLE Bible.....such as Christ's 2nd coming.
There are Bible verses in the Old Testament which describe Christ's 2nd coming also, which needs to be taken into consideration....
Isaiah 66:15-17 for example.
| Quote: |
We certainly do know that at some time, there will be a big battle during a coming of The Lord. However from the description of that battle the lead-in does sound entirely different from the lead-in of the first coming. |
Christ's 1st coming has already occured at His birth and life some 2000 years ago.
When Jesus Christ comes again for His people.......Investigative Judgment Day for Christians, as well as the Unsaved, will have been finished.
Every persons' fate will have been decided upon for all eternity....BEFORE Jesus Christ can come again.
Revelation 22:10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.
22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward [is] with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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Zathrus
King Kong
Joined: 28 Aug 2002
Posts: 2269
Location: WI USA
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| Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 5:52 am Post subject: |
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I also do not believe in theories, most often held by premillenialists and variants thereof, of multiple comings of Christ and multiple judgments. The Bible speaks of the coming of the Lord, not this coming and that coming. It speaks of the judgment, not this judgment and the other judgment. And it speaks of the judgment happening on the day of Christ's appearing.
_________________
Establishing the law by receiving the righteousness which is by faith, without the deeds of the law!
2 Cor 3 "11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious."
Certified Chalcedon Compliant
Officially approved in 451 |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3035
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Zathrus wrote: | | I also do not believe in theories, most often held by premillenialists and variants thereof, of multiple comings of Christ and multiple judgments. The Bible speaks of the coming of the Lord, not this coming and that coming. It speaks of the judgment, not this judgment and the other judgment. And it speaks of the judgment happening on the day of Christ's appearing. |
The difference you speak of is the 'executive' Judgment.
In any court of Law.....there is the 'investigation' process....then, the final executive Judgment, wherein the sentence is put into action, be it going to jail, or being set free.
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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