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Jacinth
Ferret
Joined: 28 Nov 2007
Posts: 119
Location: The Atlantic Coastal Plain
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 Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 2:01 pm Post subject: |
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saintmichaeldefendthem,
Why are you so focused on homosexuality? Is this a sensitive issue to you for one reason or another? |
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saintmichaeldefendthem
Big Lion
Joined: 21 Aug 2007
Posts: 979
Location: Boise, Idaho
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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Jacinth,
This is the "Homosexuality and the Bible" forum. If you don't want to discuss homosexuality, then FIND ANOTHER FORUM!
And you can take your demonic psychobabble with you!
_________________
What a stunning rhetorical riposte, sir! I say, you've cut me to the quick! The incisive thrust of your logical cutlass has struck me to the bone! Alas, I fear the wound is fatal! O, untimely death! |
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saintmichaeldefendthem
Big Lion
Joined: 21 Aug 2007
Posts: 979
Location: Boise, Idaho
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | I'm kinda browsing through this thread, catching up. I'll just point this out:
You can't use Romans 1 to say the new testament condemns homosexuality.
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Zathrus. I've never done drugs but what you're smoking must be good. I've always wanted to experiment. Do you have any extra?
_________________
What a stunning rhetorical riposte, sir! I say, you've cut me to the quick! The incisive thrust of your logical cutlass has struck me to the bone! Alas, I fear the wound is fatal! O, untimely death! |
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FFT
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 6104
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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So defensive.
Romans 1 is an example of how God punishes idol worshipers. Everyone seems to conveniently forget the "for this reason" part when they start quoting.
_________________
When Science was in its crib, Religion tried to strangle it. When Science was in its infancy, Religion tried to abuse it. Now that Science is grown up, Religion wants to be in its good graces.
Theology is philosophy/ethics for people who already know what conclusion they want to come to. |
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Jacinth
Ferret
Joined: 28 Nov 2007
Posts: 119
Location: The Atlantic Coastal Plain
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | This is the "Homosexuality and the Bible" forum. If you don't want to discuss homosexuality, then FIND ANOTHER FORUM! |
I never said I don't want to discuss it. I just noticed that you are very occupied with the issue of sex between partners of the same sex. I was just curious as to why you have such a devoted interest.
| Quote: | | And you can take your demonic psychobabble with you! |
What did I say that you regarded as demonic psychobabble? |
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Zathrus
King Kong
Joined: 28 Aug 2002
Posts: 2269
Location: WI USA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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| saintmichaeldefendthem wrote: | | Zathrus. I've never done drugs but what you're smoking must be good. I've always wanted to experiment. Do you have any extra? |
 Shocked and amazed by my statement, are you?
Acts 26:25
But he said, I am not mad, most noble [saintmike]; but speak forth the words of truth and soberness.
Was Romans 1 speaking about humanity in general, or did Paul have a specific group of people in mind? Was it about all people in all ages, under both covenants, or did he have a specific group in mind?
Before you respond that it's absurd to limit Romans 1 to only a specific group because the behaviors listed there are common to all the human race, ask yourself what Paul's point was in Romans, 1, and indeed in the first 3 chapters of Romans. Was he just ranting about how sinful everyone is? Why did he say the people he was talking about "knew God, [but] they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened."?
I think it's a not only a stretch to apply that to all people in general, but to do so totally misses Paul's point in Romans 1-3.
There ya go. Enjoy a good hit of the gospel. 
_________________
Establishing the law by receiving the righteousness which is by faith, without the deeds of the law!
2 Cor 3 "11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious."
Certified Chalcedon Compliant
Officially approved in 451 |
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pastor2022
Moderator
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 727
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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| saintmichaeldefendthem wrote: | Jacinth,
This is the "Homosexuality and the Bible" forum. If you don't want to discuss homosexuality, then FIND ANOTHER FORUM!
And you can take your demonic psychobabble with you! |
You need to stop making this kind of personal attack on another poster. This is against the board rules:
4) Respect your fellow members. No personal attacks or demeaning language. |
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saintmichaeldefendthem
Big Lion
Joined: 21 Aug 2007
Posts: 979
Location: Boise, Idaho
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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Zathrus,
I was kidding about the drugs. Nancy Reagan scared me straight with her "Just say no" commercials. 
| Quote: | Was Romans 1 speaking about humanity in general, or did Paul have a specific group of people in mind? Was it about all people in all ages, under both covenants, or did he have a specific group in mind?
Before you respond that it's absurd to limit Romans 1 to only a specific group because the behaviors listed there are common to all the human race, ask yourself what Paul's point was in Romans, 1, and indeed in the first 3 chapters of Romans. Was he just ranting about how sinful everyone is? Why did he say the people he was talking about "knew God, [but] they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened."?
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I have no doubt that Paul was addressing a variety of behaviors, but homosexuality was certainly one of them.
_________________
What a stunning rhetorical riposte, sir! I say, you've cut me to the quick! The incisive thrust of your logical cutlass has struck me to the bone! Alas, I fear the wound is fatal! O, untimely death! |
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saintmichaeldefendthem
Big Lion
Joined: 21 Aug 2007
Posts: 979
Location: Boise, Idaho
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:39 pm Post subject: |
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Pastor,
That was a bad call, sir. If you're going to step in, then I would ask you to be fair. Jacinth got personal with me before I responded. He/she said:
| Quote: | | Why are you so focused on homosexuality? Is this a sensitive issue to you for one reason or another? |
Which is absolutely none of his/her business. If you want to do some good, then get people to focus on the discussion rather than making it personal, which he/she did before I responded. As far as "demonic psychobabble", that's my feeling toward the entire profession of Freudian psychology. That was an attack on the tactic he/she used. I wasn't the one that got personal, so your rebuke is totally out of line.
Thank you.
_________________
What a stunning rhetorical riposte, sir! I say, you've cut me to the quick! The incisive thrust of your logical cutlass has struck me to the bone! Alas, I fear the wound is fatal! O, untimely death! |
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Zathrus
King Kong
Joined: 28 Aug 2002
Posts: 2269
Location: WI USA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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| saintmichaeldefendthem wrote: | | I have no doubt that Paul was addressing a variety of behaviors, but homosexuality was certainly one of them. |
So quick with a response? You're a thinking man. I hoped you'd contemplate my questions a bit, and even re-read Romans 1-3.
I see you have not even gotten my point. I never said that Paul was even addressing behaviors. In fact, part of my point here is that he is not addressing behaviors in Romans 1.
Find out who he was writing about who practiced these behaviors he listed in Romans 1. And then more importantly, find out what his real point was, which he used these folks and their behaviors only to illustrate, since they were a perfect example.
_________________
Establishing the law by receiving the righteousness which is by faith, without the deeds of the law!
2 Cor 3 "11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious."
Certified Chalcedon Compliant
Officially approved in 451 |
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Jacinth
Ferret
Joined: 28 Nov 2007
Posts: 119
Location: The Atlantic Coastal Plain
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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SMDT, no harm intended on my part. Let us move on now.
- J
P.S. I am not a fan of Freudian psychology. Jung is more down my alley.  |
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Zathrus
King Kong
Joined: 28 Aug 2002
Posts: 2269
Location: WI USA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks guys. I'm kinda hoping this thread doesn't get locked.
_________________
Establishing the law by receiving the righteousness which is by faith, without the deeds of the law!
2 Cor 3 "11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious."
Certified Chalcedon Compliant
Officially approved in 451 |
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saintmichaeldefendthem
Big Lion
Joined: 21 Aug 2007
Posts: 979
Location: Boise, Idaho
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| Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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Zathrus,
I know what you're trying to say. What I'm saying is it doesn't matter who he was addressing. His condemnation of homosexuality was clear and forthright, and there was no attempt to confine this stricture to a certain element of society.
_________________
What a stunning rhetorical riposte, sir! I say, you've cut me to the quick! The incisive thrust of your logical cutlass has struck me to the bone! Alas, I fear the wound is fatal! O, untimely death! |
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FFT
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 6104
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:20 am Post subject: |
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| saintmichaeldefendthem wrote: | | His condemnation of homosexuality was clear and forthright |
What condemnation?
Any time someone wants to postulate an argument that leads from "unnatural" to "sin" I'm game, but I've yet to see one that was valid.
_________________
When Science was in its crib, Religion tried to strangle it. When Science was in its infancy, Religion tried to abuse it. Now that Science is grown up, Religion wants to be in its good graces.
Theology is philosophy/ethics for people who already know what conclusion they want to come to. |
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saintmichaeldefendthem
Big Lion
Joined: 21 Aug 2007
Posts: 979
Location: Boise, Idaho
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| Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 6:45 am Post subject: |
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FFT said:
| Quote: | What condemnation?
Any time someone wants to postulate an argument that leads from "unnatural" to "sin" I'm game, but I've yet to see one that was valid.
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You're kidding, right? What does Paul need to say about it to clarify it as sinful, and why does he need to follow your criteria? He said it was unnatural and shameful. He would also assume that his audience would be aware that it's considered by God to be an abomination because of the Jewish Scripture.
Sheesh! Talk about trying to ignore the elephant in the room!
_________________
What a stunning rhetorical riposte, sir! I say, you've cut me to the quick! The incisive thrust of your logical cutlass has struck me to the bone! Alas, I fear the wound is fatal! O, untimely death! |
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