Dialogues on the Trinitarian Doctrine

thunder · Lion King Joined: 13 Sep 2003 Posts: 1222

The Power and soverignty of God........makes Him capable of doing any thing and many of the things that He does are in direct contradiction to what we perceive to be within the boundaries of human thought. He made our earthly laws of physics but He doesn't have to keep them.

When Jesus raised the dead, the people said," how did He do that?"

When Jesus turned water into wine, evryone was thankful for the delicacy but wondered, how did this happen.

By the time Jesus had finished his three year ministry even the apostles and His closest followers were so frustrated with Him that, very few saw Him at Golgotha and only Peter made his way near the unfair judgement of Christ.

They were so upset over His actions that most were unable to walk with Him or to even show up at the upper room according to Acts. 1, even after He had been seen walking around after being put to death and buried.

Its easy for us to say," I would have been there for Him." But many of His closest followers rejected Him late in His earthly ministry. They could not figure out how he did it and neither did they know what He was going to do next.

His being put to dath was not on their agenda.

The Lord takes councel from Himself...not from men, angels or Mary...and thank God that he does so that man can never say," I convinced God to not do this, or that," etc., therefore He does not answer to us, we answer to Him.

Who am I to say to God," you can't do that," or " if I can't do that then neither can you."

When the Lord looks for me, He will always find me rite behind him, where I belong, because I must be following Him, not leading Him.

If I ever find myself leading Him, guess who is wrong...that's rite...me.

When Jesus tought them to pray, He was trying to make them think in terms beyond that which those they lived by all of their lives.

Note : Jesus tried to get Peter to think, believe and live beyond the earthly laws that Peter was use to when Peter walked on the water toward Jesus until he noticed what he was doing, then immediately began to drown.

In scripture I see a Jesus who tried to make people think in ways that they could not fathom. The more miracles Jesus did, the further the people slipped into misunderstanding Him.

We followed Him for three years thinking that He was going to set up a powerful and heavenly church where we were going to be the members, and now Raboni is dead.

By the time that He died, all the followers could think of was, now what are we going to do?

The disciples who walked with Jesus on the road to Emmaous were without hope for their future, until they knew it was Jesus walking with them.

Then He tought them Christ from all of the prophets and their hearts were filled with joy, but it took a supernatural ( a law being implemented that is not a known law of our earthly physics ) act of Christ to inspire them," He opened their understanding.

That is what we all need from God, besides salvation, a spiritual revelation that concludes in our mind that Jesus is, and that He is a rewarder of them who diligently seek Him," not seek from Him.

thunder
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Submit to God in Christ

thunder · Lion King Joined: 13 Sep 2003 Posts: 1222

If Jesus is God...?

Well...if you wonder how He did that...you probably don't know how He spoke into the eternal ether of everlasting immortality and spoke worlds into existance...the very entire universe...made something from nothing.

If you are going to question how Gos anything...then you must also be willing to force Him to divulge everything to you...

...you...and who are we to force God to tell us anything ?

I love the Lord Jesus and is easy for me to step out on a precarious limb and say things like... " By the time Jesus had finished his three year ministry even the apostles and His closest followers were so frustrated with Him that, very few saw Him at Golgotha and only Peter made his way near the unfair judgement of Christ."

For one because it's true, it's scriptural and I know people and people get frustrated with things they don't understand and are obligated to be near one or more people who are unpredictable.

If any thing...Jesus was unpredictable as a man.

thunder
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Submit to God in Christ

lowers · Big Goldfish Joined: 22 Jul 2005 Posts: 70 Location: SC

It is awesomely true that He spoke things into being [the plants (incl. earth), water, sky, lights, etc.].

But all humans & creatures were given life by His breath.

Now that 'll blow you away. Laughing

You said:

Bridget · Rattlesnake Joined: 29 Jun 2003 Posts: 443

How did Moses do the things he did? Yeshua did them the same way, through the power God gave Him. Yeshua was sent into the badlands to be tested just as all servants of God were tested even from Abraham. Yeshua was given power, just enough power to show He was a messenger of God and no more. In John 1:1 we are told Yeshua was God's word, that is exactly what He was, He spoke God's word. He is not a God. Only in the Pagan beliefs would anyone other then Yahweh be called God. From the Pagans we get Resurrection Sunday named Easter for a Pagan Godess named Iskar. Where do we get a celebration of Easter Eggs and Easter Candy from? Where do we get the Easter date of Sunday when He arose on a Saturday. Where do we get the date for Christmas December 25th when that date no shepherds would have been watching their sheep it would have been too cold. Where does Lent come from? All these rites are Pagan, do not stem from the Jewish man Yeshua or His Jewish Apostles. No Jewish person in the first century including Yeshua Himself would claim another God but Yahweh/Elohim.

plain_me · Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:52 pm Post subject:

I sincerely hope that this debate is not over with. If it isn't, then all that are here will have something new to reply to now.

Bridget, I am not a supporter of pagan religions, which is one reason that I go into Catholic churches & witness to priests when I have the opportunity. That being said, I am a definite supporter of the Trinity based on the Biblical evidence that is very clear. There are many verses that explain the Trinity itself & others that make it pretty well evident that the apostles themselves held this to be a truth. A very indicative group of verses comes out of Romans 8:9-11. Very plainly, these verses use the Spirit of God (the Father) & the Spirit of Jesus interchangeably. This just happens to be my favorite excerpt from the scriptures, but if this is not conclusive enough for you (or anyone else for that matter), please reply & I have a whole slew of Biblical references to the Trinity.