Homosexuality is a sin!

StElsewhere · Guest

I am still not gay, but there's no rational reason to prevent gays from marrying when it gets right down to it.

I need not reiterate the "Adam and Eve" vs "Adam and Steve" argument...or do I?

The point of that link was that we see homosexuality all over the animal kingdom. Show me in the WOG that using a computer is natural.

Soooo you equate homosexuality with the behavior of animals???..Well ain't that eye opening?(' Shocked

')

Psychology. It's not a choice.

Mon Deiu...Psychology...is an ORIENTATION? ...Listen Dude...whether or not you are gay... For a man to turn his butt to another man...Bro....that is a CHOICE...

. Insisting/implying that homosexual orientation is a choice.

Like I said... one has got to want to...to offer ones butt to another man...is a serious CHOICE

QED.

...and QED is short for what?

And is this true of your stance on homosexuality? How?

Because I believe the LORD...and I believe His word...all of my life...I know to do nothing else but to be guided by that same words...I don't need to dissect it ...or mold it around any idea or notion I wish to find biblical approval for Cool

Nobby · Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 9:22 am Post subject:

StElsewhere, please at least it civil. OK?

FFT · Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 10:32 am Post subject:

RevJP · Moderator Joined: 18 Apr 2003 Posts: 6845 Location: USA

Evee · Moderator Joined: 13 Sep 2005 Posts: 600

St. Elsewhere (which I loved that show by the way when it was on), When you come in w/the guns ablazing people tend to get off on the wrong foot. So I at least am extending my hand in civility & apologize for any nasty things I might have said to you to cause offense to you....On that note, I ask that you please refrain from using the word "homos" (the proper term is homosexuals). I also ask that this be a civil discussion/debate & the spirit of Christ be in people's words. I will vow to maintain that requirement myself. I realize your opinions & views are very strong; as are the rest of us posting here. Please respect that.

atoz · Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:21 pm Post subject:

lone-traveler · Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:36 pm Post subject:

Yes,
that was a very good post Evee...
thankyou
lone

StElsewhere · Guest

StElsewhere · Guest

I need not reiterate the "Adam and Eve" vs "Adam and Steve" argument...or do I? You consider it an argument?

In law...'argument' means different things...my bad..I should have used a better word...But you got the point nonetheless...Did you not?

A similar analogy could be made with those animals that practice heterosexual monogamy.

I consider heterosexual ...people who are married and faithful to one spouse...as fulfilling the word of the LORD...and you?

I like that you're putting words in my mouth, though.

Moi!...Never!(' Rolling Eyes

')

Do you choose who you're sexually attracted to?

Yes! ...just as you do and everyone else does

Welcome to the internet, where it takes all of ten seconds to find the complete definition of any word. It's an abbreviation of quod erat demonstrandum, "which was to be demonstrated." In other words, when you see that I've left simply "QED" in response to one of your responses, it means I feel you simply proved what I was saying.

I learn something new everyday...thanks! Being from Brooklyn...Pig Latin I had down pat!(' Wink

')

It's about attaining a correct interpretation. This is impossible when the only thing you read is the result of various contradictory interpretations over the thousands of years it's existed.

You see there in lies the big difference between you and I ...I believe that the KJV is authorized by the True and Living God...as His written word given to mankind ... effectively bringing His written word out of the Dark Ages and our of the ancient languages...Into the marvelous light.

Also, do you enjoy football?

Yep...Those sorry Jets and Giants! Wink

[/b]

lone-traveler · Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:44 am Post subject:

StElsewhere · Guest

St. Elsewhere (which I loved that show by the way when it was on), When you come in w/the guns ablazing people tend to get off on the wrong foot.

I tell the truth about the WOG ...and I defend it fiercely... and for that I can nor will I ever apologize...If people are offended by the WOG...it is because the WOG cuts like a two-edged sword... not me!

So I at least am extending my hand in civility & apologize for any nasty things I might have said to you to cause offense to you....

Sis...there hasn't been one thing you have said that I have taken offense to on any level...I am surprised that you think you have been abrasive...you haven't...so no need to apologize...but I'll accept it if it means that much to you...

On that note, I ask that you please refrain from using the word "homos" (the proper term is homosexuals).

Evee...Look ... I call a spade a spade ...not an earth moving implement ...this is an adult forum and we all use shorthand ... and abbreviated terms

I also ask that this be a civil discussion/debate & the spirit of Christ be in people's words.

Have you ever read?:
Tts 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;

I will vow to maintain that requirement myself. I realize your opinions & views are very strong; as are the rest of us posting here. Please respect that.

I hear what you are saying...but I see no offense on either side...I take your views as seriously as they are presented...if they are claimed to be scriptural...I'm gonna hold yours and anyone else's feet to the fire...you'll either back it up or take it back... or just run away...all three options are in play here!...when it comes to the WOG I don't suffer fools lightly...and that is not directed at you...I say that in general...I defend the WOG as best as the LORD has given me knowledge and understand to do so....I don't play with God or His word!...neither do I allow others to and let it go unchallenged.

Learn from people. That's what makes this forum so interesting.

If you want me to learn that which is contrary the WOG...NOT...but I do learn things everyday...I learned what QED means...Proud of me?

2Ti 3:16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Exactly...REPROOF ..CORRECTION...FOR INSTRUCTION IN RIGHTEOUSNESS!...no beef here!

When Paul was writing this letter to his friend, Timothy, there was no such thing as the Bible. He would have been talking about the Old Testament b/c that was the "scripture" at that particular time.

For that very reason you rarely see me use the word "BIBLE"... I have and always will refer to the 1611 KJV as the WOG... you don't have to...but hey!...that's me!

Please try telling this to a teenager who is attracted to the same sex & has not acted upon that yet. Try telling them that their feelings are "unnatural" & you will find that you have just alienated someone further.

I would tell that teenage who ...when pass the age of 12 ...that they are responsible for their soul and is answerable to the One True and Living God ...that No matter how we think we are born ...no matter how we "feel"...there is right in the sight of the LORD and there is that which is sin... and that is why the WOG says we ALL MUST BE BORN AGAIN... and I would warn them about acting on such ungodly and unnatural impulses...and as far as alienating them...these days nearly nobody tell teens that there is anything that is WRONG or SIN...they are constantly bombarded with if you feel it ...just do it!... I would probably have done more to help when that teens sould then anything else they've learned from this cruel world...

I have a question & please just try to answer the question w/o any smart comments being thrown -- When did you first notice the opposite sex, at what age?

Me?... ohhh around 12...had my first kiss and my 13th birthday.

So you don't believe that you can learn from others who have linguistic credits?

No... that is not what I am saying...with me having no knowledge of those languages...I can't independently confirm what they are putting forth as a "better" translation...as truth...do you you understand what I am saying?...a person fluent in Aramaic ...can tell me anything...can't they?...How do I know it's true? How do I do as the word say to do... "study to show thyself approved"?...Study Aramaic? Get real!...that is why my best choice to to stick with the tried and true...Good Ole KJ!...is it 100% ...verbatim? No...But it is the best the world has got going!

I know I enjoy listening to others who are more schooled than I am. It helps me understand what God is trying to say better so I can live my life better.

Good for you...but I don't want ANY teaching that is contrary what the WOG has to say...My faith is rock solid...I shall not be moved!...and That is just where these 52 years have planted me...and I am blessed for it.

Please re-read what I wrote. It's not that I don't believe what it says. I try to understand what it is He's trying to say to us. I have discovered after being a Christian for all my life that what we read on the pages has a deeper meaning most of the time. We just have to look for it to understand it.

Look ...The WOG doesn't morph over time... understanding is increased in one of two ways ... in truth or in deception ...any doctrine that says the WOG doesn't condemn homosexuality is a LIE from the pit of hell...and Sis..if that offends you ...with all the love I have in me ... I don't care if it hurts...it is the truth...and it is an abomination in His sight...]

I didn't "support & favor" as you put it at first. Actually, I don't "favor" homosexuality at all. I am a heterosexual. God did open my eyes eventually when He saw that I was just as close-minded as the rest of 'em. He showed me my bigotry & released me from its bondage.

Sooo the LORD told you that homosexuality is NOT an abomination before Him?...or did He say ... tell those caught up in it...you are really a good person...and the LORD knows that you just can't help yourself...and it isok..the LORD knows your heart?

You do not need to tell me where my salvation lies. I already know that. Tell me, do you believe that once you're saved you can behave any which way you choose?

Of course not...we are to walk in newness of life...turning from evil...seeking that which is above...is what the WOG says!

Obviously, from what your stance is on this particular subject, you don't. So, how is it that homosexuals, whom you believe are committing a grievous sin, are going to burn in eternal fire & you aren't b/c you're not?

Ever read:
1Pe 4:18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
1Pe 4:19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls [to him] in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

Is it not true in the gospel of John 3:16-18: "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[f] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

Correct...but where do you read that we are to pick and choose the parts of the WOG we agree with ...and to discard the parts that rubs us the wrong way?...Ummm...I believe the "For God so loved the world..." part ...but the ..."Mankind is not to lay with mankind as with a women is an abomination"...part is not of my liking so I choose to ignore this ...This doesn't mean what it says it means...but the part about God loving everybody is... OH REALLY?

Are you God that you can look into a person's heart & know if Jesus is a part of their life?

Surely not...but the better question is Does Jesus know the person?...For in that day MANY shall say LORD, LORD...but I will say "Depart from Me I knew thee not".

Only God can know the true intentions of a person's heart. Would you agree that a person can look "righteous" on the outside, yet be far from Jesus on the inside?

Correct again!

You had accused me of being a homosexual by making the statement "condones YOUR lifestyle" meaning the lifestyle of a homosexual.

I did correct that ...by restating did I not?

And what lifestyle would that be if a person who is homosexual has not had sex w/anyone yet?

As a man thinketh so is he!

I'm assuming you're talking about a sexual "lifestyle" b/c other than that, there really is no difference between hetero vs homosexual.

Double -Speak!

I expect an apology for assuming something about me that you did not take the time to get to know w/o jumping to conclusions.

Mea Culpa!...feel better?(' Rolling Eyes

')

It seems you do that quite a bit. Instead of getting to know the people on this forum, you start attacking them from the get-go. Is this really in the spirit of Christ?

I defend the WOG against liars who try to twist it into something that it doesn't mean...and I will never apologize for that...not to you or anyone else! Show me where the LORD frowns on His people standing up for the Truth of His Word?

No, you don't lack understanding in other areas I'm sure. I do not know your educational background. But being that you are insisting that those of us who have taken the time to understand what the Roman culture was like back then are wrong & we don't know what we're talking about, it seems as if you do not wish to learn anything about a subject you don't understand.

Whatever!(' Rolling Eyes

')

Thinking that homosexuality is a choice shows that you are not learned in that area. Choosing whom you sleep with, if that's what you're talking about, that I agree is a choice. However, when a little girl notices another little girl on the playground thinking she's cute & a little boy noticing another little boy on the playground thinking that he's cute -- how can that be a choice?

Pro 22:6 Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.
What is the child being taught in the home? Heather has two Mommies?...or Daddy has a roommate?

And to tell them that they're "unnatural" is belittling & alienating.

So telling them the truth is belittling and alienating?...Well your beef is with the wrong person...Once again I did NOT write the WOG...Go to the LORD and tell Him He was completely out of line to even hint that homo-anything was wrong or disgusting in His sight.

It has led to many children committing suicide b/c they think that God thinks they're a disgrace & an "abomination" in His sight.

They are led by satan to destroy themselves... not by the WOG....

Eph 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Eph 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Then as it goes to acting on said lusts:

Gal 5:16 [This] I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Jam 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

and this is the end product:

Jam 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Can you not learn from others who have studied this subject deeper? Can you not learn from others?

Sure...and I do everyday... but when the so-call "Deeper" things are contrary to the written word...I choose to believe the word.. there is the big divide between you and I...

I know that God shows me new understandings each day. God's word has not ended w/the Bible. He IS still speaking to us today, through whatever means He chooses. And yes, that would include those who reject Him. Remember the Pharoah?

Yeah...Pharaoh rejected the word of the LORD and od hardened his heart ...or said better He turned him over to a reprobate mind... same thing...Beyond repentance!

Rev 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Rev 3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
Rev 3:16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

Yes ...the very clearly describes this last church age we are in...the Laodecian church age...as I stated earlier...

Sorry, but that's not what this Bible verse means. Here is from a commentary: Christ is the faithful and true witness of God—His example is an exact representation of what God would be like if He were a man. Already, He is contrasting Himself with the Laodicean and what He finds so distasteful. They are faithless in carrying out their responsibilities to Christ. They are lukewarm—good for nothing but vomiting.
and this:
the word Laodicea means "judgment of the people," and the entire letter is a study in contrasting judgments, the Laodicean's and God's. The physical man looks at his material and social circumstances and evaluates himself as spiritually sound. On the other hand, the spiritual God looks at the same person and sees spiritual poverty.
Tell me how that applies to the homosexuals who follow Jesus.

Homosexuals who say they "follow Jesus" ...are so very deceived ...they lie on Jesus and lie on and to themselves...

This sounds more like a person that sits back saying he's saved & doing nothing after that, not acting upon that faith.

There is a delusion which is sent by God...that only God Himself can deliver from ...and that is the reprobate mind

I don't keep that kind of company. I dislike fakes. I dislike those that say they are Christian yet do not follow Jesus' example of love.

Why is it that people like you only speak of Jesus' love...but never His anger and judgment?...Does He not have the other side too?

Good to hear. If everyone did, we'd have less disease. I not only have to practice precautions in my job but I also do outside of work. You never know who has what.

Smart!

I see you didn't understand the question. I should have worded it "gods". What "gods" do homosexuals follow when they say they follow Jesus? You say they follow a different god. Would that be Ba'al? B/C I didn't know those who follow Ba'al call him Jesus?

People are likely to say anything...and I sure you know that... it is no different than how a Catholic calls themselves "Christian"...They lie to themselves if that idol worshiping scarlet beast has anything but the full wrath and judgment of God coming to it... A Catholics Holy Father is the POPE...Not Jesus....So a homosexual can be in a pentecostal church shouting...speaking in tongues and testifying ... it is all about any god you want to call it...But not about The Only True and Ling God...Jesus the Christ! Cool

Colter · Rabid Pit Bull Joined: 20 Mar 2007 Posts: 409

Forum,

An observation. Heterosexual Christain's find it quite easy to confess the so called sins of homosexuals because it's a diversion from getting honest about their own. They are oblivious to the teaching of Christ that such judgments and condemnation of people who were created Gay is an unforgivable sin because they are blocking their own forgiveness by their judgment on Gays.

These same people who so violently speak against gays get a little more "humble" when speaking about their own shortcomings like lust, pride, greed, sloth, anger, jealously and the like, they are not quite so self righteous.

Some of them hates Gays because they have homosexual tendencies and actually hate themselves.

They hide behind the so called "word of God" because they are moral cowards, they are of the ilk of the Pharisees who also hid behind the scripture when condemning Jesus.

Christianity is currently a house seriously divided and being overtaken by Islam as we have gone off in all directions away from the simple Gospel of faith and Love of Jesus. Rather then alienating yet another social group it would be better to return tho the unadulterated teachings of Jesus of Nazareth.

Judge not that you be not judged.

Colter