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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3111
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 Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 6:11 pm Post subject: Where is the ACL-Sue |
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A school, leading students in their Islamic prayers... investigated... and now they attack the reporters...
READ about it HERE.
My question, of course, where is the ACL-Sue in their tireless pursuit of the tired mantra of Separation of Church and State. Evidently it is only a separation of others church and state... not theirs.  |
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Plotinus
Tiger
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 840
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 6:59 am Post subject: |
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Hey Trinity, ole man. Hows tricks? Long time no C.
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3111
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 8:48 am Post subject: |
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| Plotinus wrote: | | Hey Trinity, ole man. Hows tricks? Long time no C. |
 Who is 'tricks'?
Did you read the article Plo? Here is a little snip that I found amazing:
| Quote: | | The report found two changes that TIZA would need to make in order to be in full compliance with separation of church and state concerns. It needs to offer bus service at the end of the school day as opposed to at the end of after-school activities (students can participate in sectarian or nonsectarian after-school programming) and it needs to hold Friday afternoon voluntary prayer sessions at a location off school grounds. |
Sooooo.. what does this mean Plo? The school is not providing bus service to all students after school. Why? Cause they all are participating in volleyball? Noooo... they are all praying to Mecca or receiving religious indoctrination... on the tax payers dime.
Second... they are herding the kids into the gym for prayer. Where else are they doing this Plo and getting away with it? When in the hell are the administrators? Are they accountable to the school district at all. You couldn’t get a clearer cut example of an abject violation of the law.
I'm not sure how many 'opt out' kids they have attending this school... but I bet there is at least one. If that is not the case... how is it, in a country where Muslims make up about 2% of the population, all of the kids are Muslim that attend this school? You might want to figure the odds of that happening.
The bottom line is these folks got busted, red handed for running a tax payer Maddrassa and the ACL-Sue says absolutely nothing. It is hypocrisy at its worst. The ACL-Sue's game is to change American Society and culture into their own convoluted ideal... not to defend individual liberty as they insist. |
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Plotinus
Tiger
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 840
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 9:46 am Post subject: |
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Well Trinity, I wouldn't have linked to the article if I hadn't read it. I recommend that people read the articles at your link and mine and make up their own minds. People shouldn't take my word for it. I also recommend checking out the website of the school.
Here is part of their mission statement:
| Quote: | Tarek Ibn Ziyad Academy believes that each human being is a significant creature entrusted with the weighty role of steward of Earth. Thus, human beings are responsible for expressing the innate human values of brotherhood, equality, justice, compassion and peace among others in ways that build up the human community. We seek to integrate our students into the fabric of American life in a manner consistent with these values. The founders aim to produce stewards of the planet Earth--not just the next generation of consumers and marketers.
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Not in favour of consuming and marketing? Sounds like a terrorist training camp to me. 
I should add to all this that there are two main issues here. First, is it right that the school should get public money. That is an internal matter for you Americans to sort out, and I do not take a position on that one. The second question is whether there is some sort of publically funded terrorist training camp here. I don't think that part has legs. |
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3111
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 10:31 am Post subject: |
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| Plotinus wrote: |
Not in favour of consuming and marketing? Sounds like a terrorist training camp to me. |
You know Plo... this is your real genious at work here.... you say a whole lot without ever addressing the subject at hand.
Did I say this was a terrroist training camp?
Answer: No
Did I say anything about consuming or marketing?
Answer: No
So... what does this comment have to do with the this public school's rejection of current law and policy?
| Quote: | | I should add to all this that there are two main issues here. First, is it right that the school should get public money. |
Um... that is why we refer to public schools as public. Whether you feel if schools should get public money or not is irrelevant in this case as the Tarek ibn Ziyad Academy is a publicly funded charter school expected to obey public laws and policies.
It didn't. So… where is your concern for the children of this school? Might they
| Quote: | | The second question is whether there is some sort of publically funded terrorist training camp here. I don't think that part has legs. |
This has nothing to do with what I posted. The school was violating the law. A TV crew went there to investigate. Official at the school, knowing that they were caught red handed, responded in a way... lets say... is pretty consistent with their contemporaries reactions to those who would dare question their beliefs and practices.
My question is though... where is the ACL-Sue when protecting the minority individual rights here? Where is the outrage at publicly funded indoctrination? Where are the crusaders for liberty.
The same place your objectivity is... absent. |
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FFT
Emperor of the Galaxy
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 5847
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 11:12 pm Post subject: |
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Read the damned article Plotinus linked to. The claims about the school (according to the Minnesota Department of Education) were blown out of proportion.
If the school does not comply with the requests of the MDE, then they lose funding/the ACLU steps in.
You're ridiculous. |
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3111
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 5:39 am Post subject: |
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| FFT wrote: | Read the damned article Plotinus linked to. The claims about the school (according to the Minnesota Department of Education) were blown out of proportion.
If the school does not comply with the requests of the MDE, then they lose funding/the ACLU steps in.
You're ridiculous. |
I did read the '$%^&ed' article Sir... I quoted directly from it. The article admits that the school was breaking the stink'en law. If they weren't, then there wouldn't be any recommendations for the school to to fix if they were inded complying with it... now would there? They were in fact using taxpayer bucks to fund their madrassa. The school itself is even connected.... (physically - far as I can tell) to a mosque for crying out loud. That, in of itself, should at least raise some eyebrows... but no... ‘we chose to ignore it as it ain't Christian... or Jewish’. It is Islamic, therefore needs to be protected by willing lemmings ignoring the basic facts.
It is absolutely amazing how folks do indeed 'strain out a gnat and swallow a camel' when defending a world view... and then criticize others on the opposite side of the issues of the same... The ACL-Sue should be 3 feet deep in this case, and you darn well know it! Their not as it is not an attack on Christianity... so they are taking a pass. |
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Plotinus
Tiger
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 840
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 5:56 am Post subject: |
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| Trinity1 wrote: | You know Plo... this is your real genious at work here.... you say a whole lot without ever addressing the subject at hand. Confused or disgusted
Did I say this was a terrroist training camp?
Answer: No
Did I say anything about consuming or marketing?
Answer: No
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My apologies old friend. I shouldn't have used irony in my post without the appropriate emoticons.
I am very glad to hear that the only issue for you is financial regulation. Your use of words like "madrassa" and "religious indoctrination" made me fear that you had something against people learning about Islam. |
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3111
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 6:41 am Post subject: |
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| Plotinus wrote: | | Your use of words like "madrassa" and "religious indoctrination" made me fear that you had something against people learning about Islam. |
I referred to it as a madrassa because I thought that is what Islamic Schools are called... maybe I was wrong.
I don't have anything against people learning about Islam... never had... however, when people are learning about it on my dime.... when that same dime is enthusiastically spent on education prohibiting the teaching of Christianity... or even the mentioning of Christ... I do get my undies in a wad. Then, when these thugs... um... I mean school administrators... rough up a camera man when he is exposing their complete disregard for my rights... I'm going to get a smidge exercised.
Anyway... I am wondering, do you ascribe to publicly funded religious education? |
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Plotinus
Tiger
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 840
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 7:49 am Post subject: |
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| Trinity1 wrote: | | Anyway... I am wondering, do you ascribe to publicly funded religious education? |
I think it should be a level playing field, which is something we do not have in Canada.
My preference would be for students to learn much more about religion in schools than they do. But they should learn about religious diversity. This would be my preference. If religious schools -- Muslim or Christian -- are to be funded out of the public purse, it is best to try to set some strong guidelines. Religion can be taught provided it is done in a way that respects the diversity of society. E pluribus unum as you Americans say it.
As it stands right now, most people in Canada and the US are ignorant about their own religions. They are taught to believe this or believe that by their parents, but that is not the same as religious education. (There is a big difference between education and indoctrination.) For Christians there is a lot to learn beyond the simple stories of the Bible. For example, most Christians do not know what the Documentary Hypothesis is, let alone whether they agree with it!
I shall be away for the next two weeks. So -- sadly -- I will not be able to contribute to this interesting discussion for the time being. Perhaps I'll pick it up in two weeks' time if it is still going. See ya. |
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Trinity1
Emperor of the World
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 3111
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 8:02 am Post subject: |
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Interesting take...
Anyway... have a safe trip. |
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