Why so many military suicides?

atoz · Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:52 am Post subject: Why so many military suicides?

[Update, 5:30pm: CBS has just released some of those numbers:

"At least 120 Americans who served in the U.S. military killed themselves per week in 2005,

CBS News learned in a five-month investigation into veteran suicides.

That's 6,256 veteran suicides in one year, in 45 states."]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/11/13/stunning-cbs-news-disc_n_72417.html

from the aisle of view,
atoz

saintmichaeldefendthem · Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:06 pm Post subject:

The question should really be: "Why are people so gullible as to be fooled by leftist news organizations that have their own clearly defined agendas?"

They make such headlines as a part of an ongoing effort to undermine our military in every way possible during a time of war. In another era in this country, this would be called treason and they would be hanged. So let's start with the facts.

There are 1,426,713 current active duty military personnel, and another 1,259,000 in various reserve components. According to the Center for Disease Control, a far more credible source than your liberal news channel, the suicide rate overall in this country is at about 9.1 per 100,000 (that 1/10th of a person is always a mystery).

Using leftist mathematics, they are probably, for the sake of their agenda, including all who have ever served, which today is about 20 million. They are also probably including KIA deaths overseas since they likely view volunteering for combat an act of suicide that comes to fruition every time a soldier dies in battle. All of this creates a smoke screen to buttress a false impression.

There are actually college courses on statistics and how they are used to lie. The more saavy among us, having seen the mechanism of statistical analysis, have learned to distrust statistics in general, especially those that conceal the study data used to acquire them. Although I'm no statistical genius, I bet if a study were done comparing the rate of suicide in the military to that of the general public, there would be little, if any difference. That's a statistic that's more realistic and credible.

Moreover, having served myself, I can attest to just how much effort the Army puts into training every soldier to detect and report signs of depression and suicide in fellow soldiers. I have been through more training classes on this subject than I can count; and one thing can be sure, the general public is not nearly so well informed. With this in mind, I would surmise that a soldier contemplating suicide has a far greater chance of being detected and receiving the help he needs than a civilian counterpart. I, myself, have on a couple occasions alerted my chain of command when I suspected someone might be having trouble.

So, Atoz, with age comes wisdom, and the wise are not so easily fooled by the craft of liars. I would hope we all woud aspire to this.

In Christ's most Sacred Heart

45degreeN · Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 6:26 am Post subject:

SMDT please just listen to yourself. you wrote

saintmichaeldefendthem · Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 5:30 pm Post subject:

atoz · Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 6:53 pm Post subject:

Pondering · King of the Jungle Joined: 15 Sep 2005 Posts: 1512

45degreeN · Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 6:31 am Post subject:

Something we can agree upon

RevJP · Moderator Joined: 18 Apr 2003 Posts: 7005 Location: USA

The truth of the matter is that suicide rates for military members is significantly higher than for the general population. They always have been and most likely they always will be.

There is also a definitive increase in that rate since the hostilities in Iraq have began.

One would also find the same statistical comparative during and just after WWII, Korea, and Viet Nam. It is the nature of war that people have to do and experience things that they simple are unable to contend with emotionally and mentally.

In most cases the rates reflect the correlation between sheer volumes of numbers and nothing more. The more people put into these situations that had no previous inclination to be involved in this type of activity necessarily places more people in the position of trying to deal with stresses they are not prepared for, or may not be capable of handling.
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Pondering · King of the Jungle Joined: 15 Sep 2005 Posts: 1512

lone-traveler · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:44 pm Post subject:

their all going to burn in hell forever anyways because they committed suicide...right?.. Sad

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Pondering · King of the Jungle Joined: 15 Sep 2005 Posts: 1512

no...I think that's a "big boogie man in the sky" kind of prohibition added by men ("church" scholars) in order to better control thier populations....

If God is capable of miracles and can intervene in each and every suicide but doesn't, then who's also complicit in each death? Wink

Just did a quick look around and there are no Biblical prohibitions...seems to stem from Jewish tradition (but not the OT) and the Christian view that a) all life is sacred and b) all life belongs to God...
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Plotinus · Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 6:20 am Post subject:

james · Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 12:37 pm Post subject:

Those numbers seem low to me. Even if with smdt figures of 9.1 out of 100,000 thats 27,300 for a population of 300 million. And with these figures military personal only make up less than 25%, nation wide. With the vast number of homeless people, depression and other mental illnesses (of whom I believe many military individuals fall into this category) and so many children growing up in a sense of hopelessness, I would think the subject to address is, What can I (or WE) do, for them???

Pondering · King of the Jungle Joined: 15 Sep 2005 Posts: 1512

you may be right (both of you)...I'm just saying, from my personal experience, suicide is tragic, but not disproportionately represented in military populations...

as for the homeless...out of all veterans, how many are homeless? a very very very very small number I expect...the fact to me seems to be that it fits the anti-war/anti-military folks ideal of portraying veterans not as heroes...but as victims.

too many folks are making a concious effort to relive Vietnam...one basic truth is this: during Vietnam there was a draft but the draft allowed the wealthy and many of the middle class to "defer" out. The current conflict is being fought 100% by volunteers...and everyone of the officers are college graduates, many who could have chosen another career path...but instead, chose to serve their nation. But the media doesn't like to talk about that...
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RevJP · Moderator Joined: 18 Apr 2003 Posts: 7005 Location: USA

The difficulty is that all reliable statistics available are from '04 and earlier, and none of the US Census statistics segregate military, or ex-military from the standard ethnic categories.

One of the few military sources I could find from the Navy began with the admonition that suicide rates are significantly higher for the military than for the general population (one must remember that 'significant' in statistical terms is a 5% difference and how that percentage is applied and/or calculated is random to whomever is doing the statistical analysis)

However, I stand by my original assertions unless someone can 'prove' me wrong... Razz

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