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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
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Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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 Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:42 am Post subject: Why Obedience ...is ALL-IMPORTANT ! |
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Obedience proves, whether a person is a Christian or not.
Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
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Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 7003
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:59 am Post subject: |
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Obedience to what?
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JP's Mind - my blog
Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
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RevJP
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| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 10:00 am Post subject: |
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Obedience to what and proof to whom?
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JP's Mind - my blog
Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3255
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 10:18 am Post subject: |
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| RevJP wrote: | | Obedience to what and proof to whom? |
Answer to Question #1.) God first requires the heart, the affections.
He requires His followers to love and serve Him with all their heart, with all their soul, with all their strength.
His commandments and grace are adapted to our necessities, and without them we cannot be saved, do what we may.
Acceptable obedience He requires.
The offering of goods, or any service, will not be accepted without the heart.
The will must be brought into subjection.
The Lord requires of you a greater consecration to Him and a greater separation from the spirit and influence of the world.
Answer to Question #2.) Ephesians 5:10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
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Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
Last edited by Silver Surfer on Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:34 am; edited 1 time in total |
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RevJP
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| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 10:20 am Post subject: |
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You didn't answer my questions.
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JP's Mind - my blog
Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3255
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:32 am Post subject: |
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| RevJP wrote: | | You didn't answer my questions. |
I answered them all right......just I didn't answer them the way you wanted me to, that's all.
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Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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RevJP
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| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:23 pm Post subject: |
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You are right, you didn't answer them the way I wanted you to. I wanted your answer to actually apply to the questions asked.
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Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
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RevJP
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Posts: 7003
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| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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Actually, let me recant that last response and be a bit more clear:
You did NOT answer my question. You provided a response, but no answer.
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Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3255
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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| RevJP wrote: | | Obedience to what and proof to whom? |
Obedience, to 'ALL' God's commandments.
And, proof that satan's implications are false, and God's words are true.
And, of course, you wish to know what satan's implications are, which is.......man, CANNOT keep God's commandments.
God (Christ) says: YES, man CAN keep all my commandments, thru the power which I shall give him, which is called, Grace.
The whole Gospel message, is based on that.
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Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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VikingMan44
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Joined: 24 Oct 2007
Posts: 60
Location: Colorado Springs
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| Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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| RevJP wrote: | | Obedience to what and proof to whom? |
Can I just say, that your posts on this subject imply that I can live however I like? That is so not what Jesus came to give us. He came to give us salvation, not freedom to do whatever the heck we want.
The initial gift of salvation is free. Great. Now that you're saved, if you name Jesus as your Lord, you no longer belong to yourself, and so are required to obey. If you willingly do not obey, how is it that Jesus is your Lord?
We are called to be salt and light, right? The flavor and light of God to the world. How does the world see the character and nature of God if we look just like them? Aren't we supposed to be different?
In Matt 5 where Jesus talks about salt and light, the VERY NEXT VERSE says, 17"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven."
Is it a coincidence that right after Jesus got done telling the disciples about being the flavor and light of God to the world that he tells them that they will have to be more righteous than the Pharisees? The former is dependant on the later.
It's not a requisite of salvation. It is however a result of salvation.
How? We now live with the power of the spirit at our disposal, which mankind NEVER had before Christ came. We now have, "everything we need for life and godliness".
Seems clear to me.
EDIT: And to actually answer your question, by my way of thinking, obedience to God, and proof to yourself. Ultimately, when each of us stands before God, there are two parties involved. Him and me. If I lived my entire life deliberately continuing in my sin... there are some pretty strong biblical arguments that say, I've got nothing to stand on at that point. Hebrews 10:26-31 talks directly to this issue.
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Lifter of heavy things
FYI, people call me Vike.  |
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Nobby
Board - Admin
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Posts: 5286
Location: Missouri
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| Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 2:54 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Viking, do you attend church service every Saturday?
If not, you don't really understand what RevJP is refering too.
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VikingMan44
Goldfish
Joined: 24 Oct 2007
Posts: 60
Location: Colorado Springs
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| Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Nobby wrote: | Hi Viking, do you attend church service every Saturday?
If not, you don't really understand what RevJP is refering too. |
I have in the past gone to a Saturday service. My church used to do a Saturday night service for the younger crowd. They'd crack the music up a bit lowder, serve free coffee. But I'm at a loss as to what that has to do with the discussion(not trying to be rude).
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Lifter of heavy things
FYI, people call me Vike. |
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Nobby
Board - Admin
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Silver Surfer
Emperor of the World
Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 3255
Location: Hayden, Idaho, USA
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| Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:44 am Post subject: |
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| VikingMan44 wrote: | | RevJP wrote: | | Obedience to what and proof to whom? |
Can I just say, that your posts on this subject imply that I can live however I like? |
That is satan's objective....."Once Saved, Always Saved" attitude.
That is how he beat Adam & Eve.....and others, throughtout the history of this earth.
Satan, plants the idea that Salvation, is a one time event.
And, that knowledge of what Grace is.....what sin is....what obedience is......what faith is......are UNimportant themes.
| Quote: | | That is so not what Jesus came to give us. He came to give us salvation, not freedom to do whatever the heck we want. |
Jesus said: 'Deny yourselves'.
| Quote: |
The initial gift of salvation is free. Great. Now that you're saved, if you name Jesus as your Lord, you no longer belong to yourself, and so are required to obey. If you willingly do not obey, how is it that Jesus is your Lord?
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Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say ?
The 7th day sabbath is the TEST of loyalty to God.
BUT, it is not the only test.
_________________
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. |
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VikingMan44
Goldfish
Joined: 24 Oct 2007
Posts: 60
Location: Colorado Springs
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| Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 8:15 am Post subject: |
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| Silver Surfer wrote: | The 7th day sabbath is the TEST of loyalty to God.
BUT, it is not the only test. |
Hmmm. I guess in response to that, I would ask why Jesus said the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Saddath in response to the Pharisees?
Jesus attitude on that as well as everything else he did and said to tear down the insane adherence the Pharisees had to a bunch of irrelevant stuff, implies to me that there are some things that are more important to God than others, even though God himself originally commanded us to do it. Those things which are more important, could best be described by his command to love God and love your neighbor. For example, Jesus never said that the command to not commit adultery was made for man, not man for the command to not commit adultery. Why? Because committing adulterly is an act displaying a distinct lack of love for the people around me.
I've stepped into the middle of a turf war, haven't I? *note to self, when starting to participate in a new forum, learn the lay of the land before opening mouth*
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Lifter of heavy things
FYI, people call me Vike. |
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