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Nobby
Board - Admin
Joined: 16 Sep 2002
Posts: 5286
Location: Missouri
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 Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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eleven,
Not village idiot!! Village Clown! 
| JB wrote: | | I am known as the village idiot around here so what I say probably won't mean a whole lot |
JB"s not the village idiot either! 
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Much Love Nobby
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Yehushuan
King Kong
Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 2793
Location: Charismatic
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| Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:15 pm Post subject: |
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| ShardikSon wrote: | | With no intention of playing the name game, the records in the four gospels are still as close to an eye-witness account as we are ever going to see. |
Only if you mean “written” eye-witness account. I shall contend that God was there, and He most certainly can provide me with a verbal eye-witness account were it to become necessary that we talk of such things.
But don't make the mistake most historians did about the Gospel of Judas. Poof and all of a sudden there we have it!
Buried deep in the vault of the Vatican lies the unedited Gospel of John. (And Jesus' Nazi Party pin.)
Yehu
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There must be a God; Natural Selection would have gotten rid of you a long time ago. |
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ChristianWoman1
Labrador
Joined: 22 May 2008
Posts: 300
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 1:42 am Post subject: |
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| eleven wrote: | | JB wrote: | Nightmare,
I am known as the village idiot around here so what I say probably won't mean a whole lot. I am not an eye witness of Him but I am an eye witness of where He has been. I have seen people healed in His name. I have seen alcoholics delivered in His name and I was changed by the Power of His name. I see Him doing this daily in people lives.
Since this happened thirty years ago that makes my Jesus historical to me.
God Bless my friend. |
Amen!!! See this is what doubters consistantly say - prove it. I can't "prove" Him but I can prove Him in me.
I am NOTHING like I was 10 years ago. The transformation is nothing short of miraculous.
You don't get that kind of new life from Santa, or lucky rabbit's feet or leprachauns. You can only get this from the One that created you.
I know God lives because He interacts with me - in my life- on a daily basis. Things happen - questions are answered, things I'm looking for suddenly show up, opportunities I'm looking for suddenly become available.
Prayers get answered!
Some people chalk this up to "luck" or "coincidence".
Those are mere words. Where do luck or coincidence get their power?
(And by the way,) I thought I was the village idiot.
When did I get bumped??
I think I want to talk to a manager.  |
I second this AMEN! The best proof I have is who I am, and who I have become...FAR from who I use to be years ago. If anyone needs "proof" of Jesus all they need to do is look at my life years ago.... looking in the mirror is all the "proof" I'll ever need 
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Don't copy the behavior and customs of this world, but let God transform you into a new person by changing the way you think.
ROMANS 12:2 |
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eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 3:29 am Post subject: |
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| Yehushuan wrote: |
Buried deep in the vault of the Vatican lies the unedited Gospel of John. (And Jesus' Nazi Party pin.)
Yehu |
uuhhhhh.....question.
Does anybody every wonder WHY the vatican even has a vault??
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Pain is inevitable;
misery is optional. |
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eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 3:32 am Post subject: |
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| ChristianWoman1 wrote: | | eleven wrote: |
(And by the way,) I thought I was the village idiot.
When did I get bumped??
I think I want to talk to a manager. |
I second this AMEN! The best proof I have is who I am, and who I have become...FAR from who I use to be years ago. If anyone needs "proof" of Jesus all they need to do is look at my life years ago.... looking in the mirror is all the "proof" I'll ever need |
Oh. I thought you were seconding the fact that I was the village idiot.
(don't even go there, Yehu!)
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Pain is inevitable;
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JB
Tiger
Joined: 16 Feb 2008
Posts: 865
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:02 am Post subject: |
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Eleven,
You mean there is more than one village idiot?
Praise God, I am not alone.
GTM |
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eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:16 am Post subject: |
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| JB wrote: | Eleven,
You mean there is more than one village idiot?
Praise God, I am not alone.
GTM |
HEY! I got an idea! We can team up and call ourselves the Village People!
Oh wait, I think that's been done before.
How do you feel about " The Nobster's"
Has quite a ring to it, don't it, huh, huh???? 
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Pain is inevitable;
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Plotinus
Big Lion
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 986
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:24 am Post subject: |
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| eleven wrote: | No eyewitness accounts?
What about Peter?
What about James?
What about Paul?
What about Matthew?
What about John? |
Ah! I was wondering if my comment would attract a response. Let me clarify my meaning. I do not think there is a strong argument for any eyewitness accounts in the New Testament on purely textual and logical grounds. Remember this is the historical Jesus (pre-resurrection).
Paul did not intersect with the earthly ministry of Jesus. Matthew and John are plausibly written by people other than the disciples of Jesus. Ditto James and Peter. Conservative scholars mostlybelieve that they were written by the people whose names head the book. Liberal scholars are doubtful.
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One would never discover the limits of soul, should one traverse every road -- so deep a measure does it possess.
Heraclitus, fragment 45, quoted in Diogenes Laertius 9.7. |
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Plotinus
Big Lion
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 986
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:26 am Post subject: |
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| JB wrote: | Eleven,
You mean there is more than one village idiot?
Praise God, I am not alone.
GTM |
It's a big village. Lot's of room for all of us.
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One would never discover the limits of soul, should one traverse every road -- so deep a measure does it possess.
Heraclitus, fragment 45, quoted in Diogenes Laertius 9.7. |
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45degreeN
King Kong
Joined: 02 Aug 2005
Posts: 2658
Location: Salem Oregon
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:46 am Post subject: |
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Based upon what first century manuscripts we have we could legitimately doubt the existence of many historical figures.
Julius Caesar for instance: we only have one 5-6 century manuscripts of his life. Copies of copies of copies.
Plato the earliest manuscripts we have of Plato come to us from about 1000 years after his life again copies of copies of copies even less of Socrates there are NO extant copies of anything he wrote only what Plato wrote or rather what other people wrote that he wrote.
Logically there are many acceptable ways to prove the existence of a historical personage without eye witness accounts. In fact based upon our legal traditions those first hand accounts may not be so reliable anyway listen in to just about any modern trial where the eyewitness testimony is called into question.
Seriously folks there is no logical reason except stubbornness to doubt the existence of Jesus.
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RevJP
Moderator
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 7003
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:48 am Post subject: |
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Nightmare has a point.
Using his reasoning I can agree with him. Personally I don't believe Plato, Alexander, Caesar, George Washington, Benjamin Franklin, and a whole plethora of other historical figures existed either...
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Psa 118:8 It is better to trust and take refuge in the Lord than to put confidence in man. |
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Plotinus
Big Lion
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 986
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:46 am Post subject: |
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| RevJP wrote: | Nightmare has a point.
Using his reasoning I can agree with him. Personally I don't believe Plato, Alexander, Caesar, George Washington, Benjamin Franklin, and a whole plethora of other historical figures existed either... |
Good point JP. But at least we know that you exist JP.  I'm not sure about myself sometimes
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One would never discover the limits of soul, should one traverse every road -- so deep a measure does it possess.
Heraclitus, fragment 45, quoted in Diogenes Laertius 9.7. |
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Plotinus
Big Lion
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 986
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:50 am Post subject: |
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| 45degreeN wrote: | Based upon what first century manuscripts we have we could legitimately doubt the existence of many historical figures.
............
Plato the earliest manuscripts we have of Plato come to us from about 1000 years after his life again copies of copies of copies even less of Socrates there are NO extant copies of anything he wrote only what Plato wrote or rather what other people wrote that he wrote.
... |
Right, although we have a bit more than this on Socrates. The writings of Xenophon (or the rewritten versions of his manuscripts) and the Clouds by Aristophanes (ditto).
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One would never discover the limits of soul, should one traverse every road -- so deep a measure does it possess.
Heraclitus, fragment 45, quoted in Diogenes Laertius 9.7. |
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ChristianWoman1
Labrador
Joined: 22 May 2008
Posts: 300
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 6:04 am Post subject: |
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| eleven wrote: | | ChristianWoman1 wrote: | | eleven wrote: |
(And by the way,) I thought I was the village idiot.
When did I get bumped??
I think I want to talk to a manager. |
I second this AMEN! The best proof I have is who I am, and who I have become...FAR from who I use to be years ago. If anyone needs "proof" of Jesus all they need to do is look at my life years ago.... looking in the mirror is all the "proof" I'll ever need |
Oh. I thought you were seconding the fact that I was the village idiot.
(don't even go there, Yehu!) |
oh gosh no...sorry about that
..you'll find my address in that village as well
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Don't copy the behavior and customs of this world, but let God transform you into a new person by changing the way you think.
ROMANS 12:2 |
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ShardikSon
Fierce Wolf
Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Posts: 590
Location: Aux Arcs
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 6:56 am Post subject: |
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| Yehushuan wrote: | | ShardikSon wrote: | | With no intention of playing the name game, the records in the four gospels are still as close to an eye-witness account as we are ever going to see. |
Only if you mean “written” eye-witness account. I shall contend that God was there, and He most certainly can provide me with a verbal eye-witness account were it to become necessary that we talk of such things.
...
Yehu |
Good point.
There ya go, nightmare.
Ask Him.
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"Logic is a defined process for going wrong with confidence and certainty" - CF Kettering
“In prayer it is better to have a heart without words than words without a heart. “- Mohandas Gandhi
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I delight greatly in the LORD;
my soul rejoices in my God...
- Isaiah 61:10 (NIV) |
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