 |
Bible-Discussion.com
Private Bible Studies and Christian Fellowship Available - Ask Nobby
|
|
|
| Author |
Message |
eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
|
 Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 4:34 am Post subject: Religion |
 |
|
Recently it was made known that Mother Theresa had doubts about her faith. She stated so in many personal letters that she sent to several people in the Roman Catholic church whom she trusted with her most inner thoughts.
It was Mother's dying wish that these letters be detroyed when she died. Instead, the Roman Catholic Church not only publicized her letters, but has let them be published in a book for the world to see.
I find this action despicable because Mother Theresa is an icon of God's love around the world. But this is not an unusual action for the Roman Catholic church - it is typical behavior. They are more interested in pushing their own agenda then they are teaching, preaching, and practicing scripture.
Their doctrinal forms of oppression keep people blind, wanting and unfulfilled, but that's exactly the way they want it because the church doesn't exist for people, it exist for the wealthy empire it has become.
Because of it's strength, and what appears to be an "authority" figure, people are swept in by this nonsense. It is my goal here, not to bash catholics, but to call attention to the nasty tactics that the catholic leadership uses in the Name of God to push it's own greedy agenda.
So I will begin.
_________________
Pain is inevitable;
misery is optional. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
admin
Beloved Admin
Joined: 28 Sep 2000
Posts: 1803
Location: Macau, China
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 6:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'm missing something. I took their action to be the opposite, to be open with information that countered her image.
_________________
Cybermonsters (Most Beloved Admin)
Favorite Octopus Video! - My Site - Studio
Have a question or need help with your account? E-mail: forum @ askland.net |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 6:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
| admin wrote: | | I'm missing something. I took their action to be the opposite, to be open with information that countered her image. |
The woman's last dying wish is that her letters be detroyed.
What justification is there for not honoring that wish?
_________________
Pain is inevitable;
misery is optional. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Plotinus
Big Lion
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 986
Location: Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
Overall, I'm not quite sure what to make of this thread. I've met a number of people who have been badly burned by their experiences in one faith community or another, and that includes the Catholic Church. Sure, there is lots of stuff to criticize. But there is a difference between recognizing that others (and other organizations) are imperfect, and condemning them for that imperfection. I take Matthew 7:1 seriously: don't condemn others, and God will not condemn you.
_________________
One would never discover the limits of soul, should one traverse every road -- so deep a measure does it possess.
Heraclitus, fragment 45, quoted in Diogenes Laertius 9.7. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Plotinus wrote: | | Overall, I'm not quite sure what to make of this thread. I've met a number of people who have been badly burned by their experiences in one faith community or another, and that includes the Catholic Church. Sure, there is lots of stuff to criticize. But there is a difference between recognizing that others (and other organizations) are imperfect, and condemning them for that imperfection. I take Matthew 7:1 seriously: don't condemn others, and God will not condemn you. |
It is not my intention to condemn anyone. All I want to do is talk about what what they are doing and then let people make their own decisions.
I'm still waiting for an answer.
What justification is there for these letters to be published? She specifically asked of her "trusted' friends of the Roman Catholic church that these letters be detroyed upon her death.
Why wasn't this wish honored?
_________________
Pain is inevitable;
misery is optional. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Plotinus
Big Lion
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 986
Location: Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
11, I doubt that any of us can really know why her wishes were not honoured. People routinely destroy letters before their deaths because of this very problem. The things we leave behind in this world no longer belong to us. (Not that they truly ever did.)
_________________
One would never discover the limits of soul, should one traverse every road -- so deep a measure does it possess.
Heraclitus, fragment 45, quoted in Diogenes Laertius 9.7. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Plotinus wrote: | | 11, I doubt that any of us can really know why her wishes were not honoured. People routinely destroy letters before their deaths because of this very problem. The things we leave behind in this world no longer belong to us. (Not that they truly ever did.) |
I asked this before. How can people destroy letters that they have sent to OTHER people? They writer no longer has possession of them. She was depending of the recipient of that letter to honor her wish and destroy it.
He didn't. He not only disrepected her wish, but he went to those in higher authority (who is supposed to be the infallible teacher of scripture) and now all have agreed to publicize this.
Does anybody but me see anything wrong with this?
_________________
Pain is inevitable;
misery is optional. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Zathrus
King Kong
Joined: 28 Aug 2002
Posts: 2270
Location: WI USA
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
I for one think that making public what was intended to be kept between Mother Theresa, God and a few people close to her is less than honest.
And I skimmed through the thread that this one is an offshoot of. Thanks for relating your experiences. Many of us have lived through various types and degrees of abuse from a variety of religious organizations. We now share a thankfulness and appreciation that our lives and relationships with God are not being controlled by some church leadership or organization any longer.
_________________
Establishing the law by receiving the righteousness which is by faith, without the deeds of the law!
2 Cor 3 "11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious."
Certified Chalcedon Compliant
Officially approved in 451 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Zathrus wrote: | | I for one think that making public what was intended to be kept between Mother Theresa, God and a few people close to her is less than honest.And I skimmed through the thread that this one is an offshoot of. Thanks for relating your experiences. Many of us have lived through various types and degrees of abuse from a variety of religious organizations. We now share a thankfulness and appreciation that our lives and relationships with God are not being controlled by some church leadership or organization any longer. |
Thank you Zathrus, you are a gererous and loving spirit.
May God bless you abundantly!!!
However, I am looking at this as an opportunity to get those who claim they know God to back up what they say. Not that I am expecting the pope himself to show up here, but how wonderful that would be!!!
Zathrus said he felt that the publishing of confidential letters was "less than honest".
I agree.
However, the one aspect that I have always loved most about Jesus was the fact that He never backed down from liars. When He confronted the Pharisees, He didn't say, "Hey guys, I think what you are doing is less than honest." He said, YOU VIPERS!!!
It is my personal philosophy, when I'm not sure what to do, to go to my Bible and do it the way Jesus did.
So yeah, I think what the RC church is doing to Mother Theresa is "less than honest" also. But I'm too old and too tired to pull any more punches. We are in the last minutes of the last days. So to those "less than honest" holy men I say---
YOU VIPERS!
You liars of the gospel. Why would you do this?
For the love of God, or your own self promotion?
It's not freakin' rocket science..........let's keep going because this is only the beginning........
_________________
Pain is inevitable;
misery is optional. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Plotinus
Big Lion
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 986
Location: Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| eleven wrote: | | Plotinus wrote: | | 11, I doubt that any of us can really know why her wishes were not honoured. People routinely destroy letters before their deaths because of this very problem. The things we leave behind in this world no longer belong to us. (Not that they truly ever did.) |
I asked this before. How can people destroy letters that they have sent to OTHER people? They writer no longer has possession of them. She was depending of the recipient of that letter to honor her wish and destroy it.
He didn't. He not only disrepected her wish, but he went to those in higher authority (who is supposed to be the infallible teacher of scripture) and now all have agreed to publicize this.
Does anybody but me see anything wrong with this? |
Well, let me play devil's advocate. I believe I understand your sense that an injury to Mother Theresa's memory may have been done. However, it seems that the decision not to destroy the letters was not made maliciously, but rather was part and parcel of the canonization process. Of course, sometimes we injure without intending to. But I think there are two sides to the broad issue. The main question I would like to ask is whether there is an act of dishonesty beyond the injury.
When you send a letter to someone you are giving them something. Correct me if I am wrong, but legally the letter belongs to the person who receives it. If I send you a letter, and ask that the contents be confidential, I only have the right to have this request respected if you contact me and agree. Or if there is some external consideration that morally obliges the recipient to keep confidentiality. The fact that I wrote the letter gives me no claims over it. So the only way to assert your right not to make the contents of a letter public is not to send it to begin with. Did Mother Theresa have an agreement about confidentiality, or was this just her wish?
On another issue, I have a great admiration for Mother Theresa. She seems to have been a spiritually strong individual. The fact that she went through a dark night of the soul even up to her death does not diminish this.
_________________
One would never discover the limits of soul, should one traverse every road -- so deep a measure does it possess.
Heraclitus, fragment 45, quoted in Diogenes Laertius 9.7. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cballard
Grizzly Bear
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 728
Location: WV
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
eleven, I'm sorry I'm late to join you at this thread. This discussion so far still seems to be on the Mother Teresa issue. But, as you can see, different people see things differently. Let's discuss religion.
May we, without rancor, discuss our different philosophies? We might find that there are agreements among us. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 12:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Plotinus wrote: | | eleven wrote: | | Plotinus wrote: | | 11, I doubt that any of us can really know why her wishes were not honoured. People routinely destroy letters before their deaths because of this very problem. The things we leave behind in this world no longer belong to us. (Not that they truly ever did.) |
I asked this before. How can people destroy letters that they have sent to OTHER people? They writer no longer has possession of them. She was depending of the recipient of that letter to honor her wish and destroy it.
He didn't. He not only disrepected her wish, but he went to those in higher authority (who is supposed to be the infallible teacher of scripture) and now all have agreed to publicize this.
Does anybody but me see anything wrong with this? |
Well, let me play devil's advocate. I believe I understand your sense that an injury to Mother Theresa's memory may have been done. However, it seems that the decision not to destroy the letters was not made maliciously, but rather was part and parcel of the canonization process.
|
Let's stop right there. Did you ever stop to ask yourself what the "canonization process" is all about?
Why is it necessary?
Is it necessary?
What is it for?
How is it going to benefit Mother Theresa?
How is this going to benefit the world?
The canonization process is nothing more that the RC's investigation into a person life to see if they meet the vatican's definition and criteria as far as the "official" labeling of a Saint (with a capital S, and yes they distinguish between a capital S saint and an s saint.)
Now tell me. Is there any doubt in anyones mind that this woman was a Saint??
Devoting her entire life to serving the poor - walking in places most of us would not want to place our dogs, dealing with every kind of heartship and disease known to man, yet never sick herself , as she hugged, loved, kissed, and gave people the message of God's love.
Is there any doubt in anyone's mind that she truly was a disciple of Christ???? If you have even 2 brain cells that only meet on special occasions, you would recognize that this woman was a genuine Saint. A role-model of Christ, and someone filled with the Holy Spirit because no one in their earthly mind would choose this life-style.
Yet the RC church, is now going to betray a personal trust in order to go thru "offical canonization".
Let's get real here folks and look at what is really going on:
First of all I can't find anywhere in the Bible where there is any mention of "canonization" , can you???
Is this what we were all meant to aspire too?
But they will use this excuse to mask the betrayal to this wonderful woman.
We needed these letters to prove..............whatever.
You bunch of liars. You needed these letters because it causes sensationalism to move your own agenda forward........nothing more.
There is no biblical reference to canonization.
We don't need it.
We get it. We understood the role model Mother Theresa was, and I will think no less of her if she doesn't get the RC official seal of approval.
So ends Phase I.
Let's keep going.
_________________
Pain is inevitable;
misery is optional. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ChristianWoman1
Labrador
Joined: 22 May 2008
Posts: 300
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 1:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I'd like to know where canonization is in the Bible too... 
interesting thread...so far I"m with you 11, I agree....I"m just not filled with anger...where is that coming from my friend? It's one thing to disagree with a certain "religion", but clearly you have been hurt.... R you ok??
_________________
____________________
Don't copy the behavior and customs of this world, but let God transform you into a new person by changing the way you think.
ROMANS 12:2 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| cballard wrote: | eleven, I'm sorry I'm late to join you at this thread. This discussion so far still seems to be on the Mother Teresa issue. But, as you can see, different people see things differently. Let's discuss religion.
May we, without rancor, discuss our different philosophies? We might find that there are agreements among us. |
First off, I just started this thread today, so you are not late - right on time. 
Second, it is thru Mother Theresa that I wish to demonstrate what is really going on here with this religion. Bear with me.
But please, if you wish to contribute, be my guest.
I have no intention of turning this into a debate. I just want to investigate. Please join me.
_________________
Pain is inevitable;
misery is optional.
Last edited by eleven on Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:49 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
eleven
King of the Jungle
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1459
Location: Texas
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ChristianWoman1 wrote: | I'd like to know where canonization is in the Bible too...
interesting thread...so far I"m with you 11, I agree....I"m just not filled with anger...where is that coming from my friend? It's one thing to disagree with a certain "religion", but clearly you have been hurt.... R you ok?? |
The only anger in regards to this CW is that the catholic religion is the most powerful religion in the world.
Yet their doctrine is completely UNBIBLICAL.
I could even see past that, except that their rules and regulations actually hurt people, and I'm sick of it!
I'm sick to death of people being used and abused in the name of God, and what they just did to Mother Theresa was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.
So now I am fighting back. I may be a nobody in the vast expanse of this universe. And I'm sure I don't mean much on the global scale either. But I have a voice, and I will use it. If even one person is freed from the oppression of this hypocritical bunch of liars, then my job is complete.
(Boy, I never had so much appreciation for David and Goliath as I do right now.)
And BTW, don't worry about me - I feel spiritually fantastic! Thanks for asking.
_________________
Pain is inevitable;
misery is optional. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
FAQ 
Search 
Make a Donation 
Usergroups 
Contact
Register
Submit Articles 
Log in to check your private messages 
