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HeKkLeR
King Kong
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 2280
Location: Europe
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 Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 7:33 am Post subject: |
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I am surely keeping the scripture in context.
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The HeKkLeR |
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lone-traveler
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 6360
Location: USA
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| Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| HeKkLeR wrote: | Genesis 7:11-12In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, on the seventeenth day of the second month—on that day all the springs of the great deep burst forth, and the floodgates of the heavens were opened. And rain fell on the earth forty days and forty nights.
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Psa 85:11 Truth shall spring out of the earth; and righteousness shall look down from heaven.
Isa 45:8 Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.
Isa 61:11 For as the earth bringeth forth her bud, and as the garden causeth the things that are sown in it to spring forth; so the Lord GOD will cause righteousness and praise to spring forth before all the nations.
Jhn 4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
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Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 7559
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 3:23 pm Post subject: |
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I know this is off-topic, but could you guys please go vote in the creation vs. evolution forum?
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"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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Zathrus
King Kong
Joined: 28 Aug 2002
Posts: 2265
Location: WI USA
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| Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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| HeKkLeR wrote: | | Quote: | | Astronomers have known for decades that there is a lot of water in space. Hydrogen is the most common element in the Universe, and oxygen is made in stars and dispersed by events such as supernova explosions. The two elements mix in star-forming clouds and form large amounts of water (H2O). But because astronomers couldn"t measure gaseous water in cold clouds in space, they couldn"t be sure of the exact amount of water in those regions. |
And here's a quote from NASA:
| NASA wrote: | | NASA's Spitzer Space Telescope observed a fledgling solar system like the one depicted in this artist's concept, and discovered deep within it enough water vapor to fill the oceans on Earth five times. This water vapor starts out in the form of ice in a cloudy cocoon (not pictured) that surrounds the embryonic star, called NGC 1333-IRAS 4B (buried in center of image). Material from the cocoon, including ice, falls toward the center of the cloud. The ice then smacks down onto a dusty pre-planetary disk circling the stellar embryo (doughnut-shaped cloud) and vaporizes. Eventually, this water might make its way into developing planets. |
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This is extremely interesting. Cause for speculation and imagining what might be.
It makes me if wonder many of the planets orbiting other stars have much more water than the ones in our solar system. Or if it's possible that large masses of liquid water, with no solid rock core, orbit some stars.
And if there is life in other solar systems, is the majority of it aquatic? Are land dwelling creatures like us actually a minority, an oddity?
Anyone ever read any sci-fi novels or stories, or see episodes of sci-fi shows, where an intelligent alien race comes to earth, and their ships land not on land but in the oceans? And it turns out they live and breath underwater?
There was a 90's Outer Limits episode with that kind of plot. I recall reading a novel as a teen about a group of people who survived for years in the hull of a sunken ship at the bottom of the ocean, in which there must have an ample air supply and enough food for years. They were finally rescued by aquatic aliens!
And of course there is the movie The Abyss.
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Establishing the law by receiving the righteousness which is by faith, without the deeds of the law!
2 Cor 3 "11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious."
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HeKkLeR
King Kong
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 2280
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 2:38 am Post subject: |
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Good questions and speculation, Zathrus! Apart from these findings actually giving so much more credit to God's word, than many care to offer on their own, they open up a plethora of wonderings.
I have also read where water has been found (seen, registered, witnessed) on other planets in this solar system! Now, that is amazing. 
There are many great implications from the fact that there are surely large amounts of water in space... in our solar system. And then to understand that our solar system is actually contained in a bubble... wow...
Sometimes I have to just sit down and be in so much awe of God and His works and His wisdom. We men are so lowly at times, that we can only do our best by arguing and boasting over matters that we do not understand, as if we know something.
God's power and grace is boundless, indeed!
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HeKkLeR
King Kong
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 2280
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 3:59 am Post subject: |
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Thank you Lone, for your gracious approach to this.
| Lone wrote: | | The earth waters recycles itself doesn't it? The waters in the clouds come from the waters in the earth. They are "caught up" to heaven and then they "rain down" on us once again. |
Let us see what God says. Maybe we can figure out an answer to that very good question:
Job 388 Or who shut up the sea with doors, when it brake forth, as if it had issued out of the womb?
9 When I made the cloud the garment thereof, and thick darkness a swaddlingband for it,
10 And brake up for it my decreed place, and set bars and doors,
11 And said, Hitherto shalt thou come, but no further: and here shall thy proud waves be stayed?
16 Hast thou entered into the springs of the sea? or hast thou walked in the search of the depth?
22 Hast thou entered into the treasures of the snow? or hast thou seen the treasures of the hail,
23 Which I have reserved against the time of trouble, against the day of battle and war?
25 Who hath divided a watercourse for the overflowing of waters, or a way for the lightning of thunder;
26 To cause it to rain on the earth, where no man is; on the wilderness, wherein there is no man;
27 To satisfy the desolate and waste ground; and to cause the bud of the tender herb to spring forth?
28 Hath the rain a father? or who hath begotten the drops of dew?
29 Out of whose womb came the ice? and the hoary frost of heaven, who hath gendered it?
30 The waters are hid as with a stone, and the face of the deep is frozen.
33 Knowest thou the ordinances of heaven? canst thou set the dominion thereof in the earth?
Romans 10:6-7 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:)
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
Job 38:34 Canst thou lift up thy voice to the clouds, that abundance of waters may cover thee?
| Quote: | | I still believe it's spiritual.. |
Very good!
| Quote: | | The waters above being God's thoughts, the waters beneath being man's thoughts..and we meet together.. |
What if we exchanged one word in the above sentence to: The waters above being God's Word, the waters beneath being man's thoughts... and we meet together..
| Quote: | | God thoughts and man's thoughts in the firmament..in the middle. |
And the same again, here: God's Word and man's thoughts in the firmament..in the middle.
The Rock? 
Isaiah 441 Yet now hear, O Jacob my servant; and Israel, whom I have chosen:
2 Thus saith the LORD that made thee, and formed thee from the womb, which will help thee; Fear not, O Jacob, my servant; and thou, Jesurun, whom I have chosen.
3 For I will pour water upon him that is thirsty, and floods upon the dry ground: I will pour my spirit upon thy seed, and my blessing upon thine offspring:
4 And they shall spring up as among the grass, as willows by the water courses.
5 One shall say, I am the LORD's; and another shall call himself by the name of Jacob; and another shall subscribe with his hand unto the LORD, and surname himself by the name of Israel.
John 4:12-14 Art thou greater than our father Jacob, which gave us the well, and drank thereof himself, and his children, and his cattle?
13 Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again:
14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
Joel 2:28 "And afterward, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your old men will dream dreams, your young men will see visions.
Revelation 22:1Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb
| Quote: | Either way, you can look at it from a scientific or a spiritual point of view. They both make sense to me.
But I tend to read it as a spiritual application because the bible says God's word IS spiritual and so that's how I look at it. Remembering that those things that were written aforetime are as "shadows" and for our instruction for living in the spirit and not in the flesh. |
| Quote: | | And by observing the physical applications we can understand the spiritual truth behind them. |
Good stuff, Lone.
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The HeKkLeR |
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HeKkLeR
King Kong
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 2280
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 4:23 am Post subject: |
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Oh yeah... Hey Science Lovers... does anyone know what a "Protoplanetary disk" is?
| An article by Caltech on Physorg.com wrote: | | Water is an essential ingredient for forming planets, yet has remained hidden from scientists searching for it in protoplanetary systems, the spinning disks of particles surrounding newly formed stars where planets are born. Now the detection of water vapor in the inner part of two extrasolar protoplanetary disks brings scientists one step closer to understanding water's role during terrestrial planet formation. |
| wrote: | | Taking advantage of Spitzer's spectroscopic capabilities, another group of scientists looked for water molecules in the disks around young stars and found them--twice. "This is one of the very few times that water vapor has been directly shown to exist in the inner part of a protoplanetary disk--the most likely place for terrestrial planets to form," said Colette Salyk, a graduate student in geological and planetary sciences at the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena. She is the lead author on a paper about the results in the March 20 issue of Astrophysical Journal Letters. |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 7559
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:31 am Post subject: |
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I don't know exactly what your point is. If you're trying to say that the Bible predicted that there would be water in space, then I remind you what it says in Genesis:
| Quote: | | And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. |
It doesn't say,
| Quote: | | And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the water vapor in the protoplanetary disks in other solar systems. |
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"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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HeKkLeR
King Kong
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 2280
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:53 am Post subject: |
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What is a protoplanetary disk, P#?
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The HeKkLeR |
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lone-traveler
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 6360
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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is it what makes up our atmosphere?
hugs HeKkler
lone
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Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. |
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P1234567890
Emperor of the Universe
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 7559
Location: Victoria, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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| HeKkLeR wrote: | | What is a protoplanetary disk, P#? |
A disk containing mostly hydrogen, rock and heavy elements such as iron from which the planets form.
_________________
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"...with or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil -that takes religion..."
-Steven Weinberg
"I would bless my children with your destruction instead."
-Someone who shall remain anonymous. |
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HeKkLeR
King Kong
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 2280
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 9:32 am Post subject: |
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| P# wrote: | I don't know exactly what your point is. If you're trying to say that the Bible predicted that there would be water in space, then I remind you what it says in Genesis:
| Quote: | | And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. |
It doesn't say,
| Quote: | | And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the water vapor in the protoplanetary disks in other solar systems. |
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| Quote: | | HeKkLeR wrote: | | What is a protoplanetary disk, P#? |
A disk containing mostly hydrogen, rock and heavy elements such as iron from which the planets form. |
Ahhh... but God's Word surely does say: | Quote: | Genesis 1:1-2In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
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I am not trying to say... but I am saying... that God's Word told of how planets were formed, thousands of years before science could even think about how planets were formed.
Now, do you not think it extraordinarily amazing... even supernatural... yeah, supernatural... that Moses could write about something thousands of years ago, and thousands of years before his time, that scientists now are finding out to be true?
I mean... strictly from a science point of view? 
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Ana
King of the Jungle
Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 1553
Location: BC
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:05 am Post subject: |
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Just because there's water in it doesn't mean we can just call it 'water'. Also there isn't any 'dividing' of the waters from the waters involved in forming a planet.
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Truth doesn't care about theology, and theology doesn't care about truth. |
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HeKkLeR
King Kong
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 2280
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:08 am Post subject: |
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| Ana wrote: | | Just because there's water in it doesn't mean we can just call it 'water'. |
| Quote: | | Also there isn't any 'dividing' of the waters from the waters involved in forming a planet. |
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The HeKkLeR |
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HeKkLeR
King Kong
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 2280
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 3:19 pm Post subject: Re: Water in space... |
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Hi Ana,
So that I do not appear rude... for I really was not attempting to be rude, but I really was confused about your "input".
Please, if I may, let me clarify why:
| Quote: | | Just because there's water in it doesn't mean we can just call it 'water'. |
I'm not sure exactly which "we" you are referring to, but I did leave a quote from some who actually do:
| HeKkLeR wrote: |
| Quote: | | Astronomers have known for decades that there is a lot of water in space. Hydrogen is the most common element in the Universe, and oxygen is made in stars and dispersed by events such as supernova explosions. The two elements mix in star-forming clouds and form large amounts of water (H2O). But because astronomers couldn"t measure gaseous water in cold clouds in space, they couldn"t be sure of the exact amount of water in those regions. |
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| Quote: | | Also there isn't any 'dividing' of the waters from the waters involved in forming a planet. |
And again... I did provide this information and link:
| HeKkLeR wrote: | Well, P#... here's a quote from one article:
| Quote: | | Although the role of water in the formation of planets and comets is not yet fully understood, a simplified description is that some of the ice remains unprocessed and ends up in comets, while some of the ice turns into vapor and is used to make planetary atmospheres and gaseous planets. |
You can find the entire article At This LINK. |
So, I am actually not claiming anything really, but providing scientific facts, and proclaiming what God's Word says. God's Word is the One claiming anything.
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