A tiny testimony.

ChristineS · Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 8:54 pm Post subject: A tiny testimony.

I nearly became a Jehovah's Witness when I was a teenager, but I left this group when I found out that they believe Jesus was Michael the Archangel. They also believed he was raised in the spirit and not in the flesh.
It was a bit hard to leave, I made some friends with the folks I was studying with, but I had no choice.
I was eventually baptized in a Baptist church.

TBax · King of the Jungle Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 1937

ChristineS,

Thats a shame Christine.
Do you believe Jesus is King of God's kingdom?
How would this be possible if he is Flesh and Blood?
1 Cor 15:50 However, this I say, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit God’s kingdom, neither does corruption inherit incorruption.

Do you not believe this: 1 Cor 15: 45 It is even so written: “The first man Adam became a living soul.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

Do you still think Jesus is flesh and blood?

ChristineS · Posted: Sat Apr 08, 2006 9:11 am Post subject:

This is from Luke Chapter 24 (this is KJV)-
It says here very clearly that Jesus said he was flesh and bone.

36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, "Peace be unto you. "
37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.
38 And he said unto them, "Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? "
39 "Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

I could say more, but this says it all.
Do you still he believe he was raised only in spirit?

Luke Chapter 24, verses 36-39 read the same way in the JW Bible. I used to have one, and I compared it to other translations and they all read the same thing.

TBax · King of the Jungle Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 1937

Christine,

YOURS:It says here very clearly that Jesus said he was flesh and bone.

MINE:Correct.As a spirit Jesus could MATERIALISE physical bodies for himself.Do you remember how the angels that sinned in Noah's day did this.

YOURS:Do you still he believe he was raised only in spirit?

MINE:Yes.Jesus sacrificed his perfect human life for mankind.Jesus is the primary Ruler of that Kingdom,isn't he?

1 Cor 15:50 However, this I say, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit God’s kingdom,

ChristineS · Posted: Sat Apr 08, 2006 12:40 pm Post subject:

Yes, I heard that before as I did use to study with JW for about 2 years. They told me that Jesus made a body for himself. I don't believe that. If that is true where does it say that? I have read every book in the Bible more than once, and I don't remember it saying anywhere that Jesus made a body for himself.

What about Michael the Archangel? Do you still believe, as a JW, that Jesus is Michael the Archangel? Even if Jesus was raised in the Spirit, would that make Him Michael? Where does it say that He was Michael, if it does?

I can accept a lot of things, I believe in The Trinity, but I can accept that others don't and I believe that they are saved, just the same, and I can accept that they may be right. But one thing I have a hard time believing is that Jesus is Michael the Archangel, that is one thing I just can't accept.

TBax · King of the Jungle Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 1937

Christine,

YOURS:Yes, I heard that before as I did use to study with JW for about 2 years. They told me that Jesus made a body for himself. I don't believe that. If that is true where does it say that? I have read every book in the Bible more than once, and I don't remember it saying anywhere that Jesus made a body for himself.

MINE:In another account it mentions that Jesus appeared to his disciples behind a locked door.How did the flesh and blood get through the locked door?

The Bible doesn't ever say specifically that any spirit creature "materialised" a body for himself.But we know it has happened,like the spirits that forsook their original positions in heaven in Noah's day and had relations with women.Also the angelic messangers that spoke to Lot,Manoah,that wrestled with Jacob among others obviously materialised bodies for themselves,even though it doesn't specifically say that.

Think about it,if Jesus is flesh and blood,where is his body today?What purpose would it serve for Jesus to be flesh and blood today?

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Regarding Jesus and Michael the Archangel,it's true there are no scriptures that directly say "Jesus is Michael the Archangel."But there are scriptures that indirectly point to this being the case.

(Daniel 10:21) However, I shall tell you the things noted down in the writing of truth, and there is no one holding strongly with me in these [things] but Mi´cha·el, the prince of YOU people.

Notice Michael is the prince of you people.

(Daniel 12:1) “And during that time Mi´cha·el will stand up, the great prince who is standing in behalf of the sons of your people. And there will certainly occur a time of distress such as has not been made to occur since there came to be a nation until that time. And during that time your people will escape, every one who is found written down in the book.

Notice this is talking about the last days when the governments turn on true religion.The Great Prince stands up in their behalf.
Who is this great Prince?
(Isaiah 9:6) For there has been a child born to us, there has been a son given to us; and the princely rule will come to be upon his shoulder. And his name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.
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(Jude 9) But when Mi´cha·el the archangel had a difference with the Devil and was disputing about Moses’ body, he did not dare to bring a judgment against him in abusive terms, but said: “May Jehovah rebuke you.”

Michael is the archangel.

Notice 1 Th 4:6 16 because the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first
Jesus has an archangel's voice.If Jesus were God this would be a demotion.
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(Revelation 12:7) And war broke out in heaven: Mi´cha·el and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled

Jesus is the main part of that seed(Gen 3:15) that will bruise Satan in the head.Would it not make sence the he would take the lead in casting Satan out of heaven?
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Hebrews chapter 1 actually supports the fact that Jesus is an angel.Notice verse 9.You loved righteousness, and you hated lawlessness. That is why God, your God, anointed you with [the] oil of exultation more than your partners.
MORE THAN YOUR PARTNERS.WHO ARE THESE PARTNERS IF NOT THE ANGELS as the context shows.